#brunchtalk: Should I date my co-worker?

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The dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that The Huffington Post calls one of the top ten podcasts about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about everything from sex parties to sex droughts, date fails to diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host UA Shu, former dating coach turned dating sociologist. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Kraft chick as we explore this crazy dateable world. You know what time it is? It's time for brunch talk y'all. That's right. I love that. They're the num num num. Here we go with our brunch talk. I've listened to a few podcasts where there's like, what is it like a hype man? For the host comes on. I think we should get a hype man or hype woman, you know? Like, coming to the stage. Should we craft chicken you a shoe for brunch talk? UA, you could just do it. We don't have to hire a hype man. That's true, you're right. I just did it. I just did it. Oh, it is a heat wave right now for brunch. I heard. I heard it's really hot in SF. It's hot. It's great though, you know? I'll take it all day any day, but it is hot. Hot, hot hot. Hot. Not as hot as Austin. Not as hot as Austin. I got back from there, 100° every day, so definitely not as good. Oh my God. We were at pools every single day. It was just so you have to be. Yeah, the humidity really kills my hair. I did not have any brunches in Austin, but I did eat a lot of tacos in barbecue. A $100 worth of bars. So good. So good. We clearly did not know how to order. We're like, I think we ordered for four people that too. Oops. That's okay. That is okay. You're only in the city once every few years. It's okay to take advantage. And it's true you really don't get the same type of barbecue on the West Coast. No. You just don't. They don't do it this way. That's why I was like, I don't need to do brunch, like eggs are pretty much the same everywhere. Although a breakfast taco would have been good. That would have been good sound pretty good. But also I'm like, it's basically just eggs in a Georgia. Right. Right. Depends on the sauce. I realize everything is about the sauce. That's true. That's true. I swear I wasn't going to have tacos for at least two weeks, but maybe I'll make a breakfast. Taco. A breakfast taco. We recently went to this very scene brunch spot in LA called catch. Okay. And it's in West Hollywood. It's one of those places where I kind of knew it would be like this, but you walk in and everybody looks the same. They're dressed the same, their makeup's the same. Everyone's on their phone, but the best part was, I went to the bathroom, right? So I was behind 5 girls going into the bathroom. So I was like, oh man, I'm going to have to wait in line. We get into the restroom. None of them went to the stalls. They were all just taking photos inside the bathroom because of that. Oh my God. So it's like what is this place? Like why are people here taking pictures in the bathroom, taking pictures for each other, taking pictures through the mirror. I'm like, great. I don't have to stand in line, but I've never seen anything like it. It's just so, so the epitome of LA at its most superficial aspect. So it's like an Instagram background. It's just really pretty. The whole restaurant and there's a lot of flowers, really pretty colors, the bathroom was really pretty. So it's a good place for photos. It doesn't really think people went just to take photos, but I can guarantee we looked around all the tables. Everyone had their phones out and they were not talking to each other because they're probably posting about having brunch with their besties without actually talking to their besties. I feel like I've become that annoying person that takes photos of all my food. I've been to I do that. Buy in tuning the art of food photography, but now I'm like, I remember making fun of people like that. And now I'm one of those people. You do you. You too, you whatever makes you happy, as long as you're not asking me to take a picture of you posing with the food. Yes. In the bathroom. I went to the tiled steps in San Francisco a couple weeks. Beautiful. In there were these people that were doing a full on Instagram photo shoot and we were like, we need to walk around them. We're going to be here all day. Waiting for them. I'm so glad there was no Instagram when I was in college. Oh my God. I think that we've ruined my personality and self confidence. I can't even imagine. Well, welcome. This is totally not related to the question, but the question you will find entertaining, a question we've all entertained at some point in our lives, I think, then the question is, is it okay to date a coworker? Okay, well, a little more context from the listener that wrote in about this. So she said, I've never done it before, nor have I had the desire to in my overthinking brain can think of plenty of reasons not to shit where I eat.

00:05:03 - 00:10:07

But recently, I've been feeling some sort of vibes from a coworker. This is someone I don't see every day because of the pandemic we have different schedules and we only see each other roughly once a week. But earlier this year, I suddenly started feeling vibes from him, heart face, emoji. Someone has a crush. The thing is, I sometimes have trouble telling if it's just someone being friendly or if the vibes I'm sensing are actually real. Because we're adults and I believe that if there were interest, he would be direct about it or rather I'd like him to be direct about it. And while I still enjoy having my little crush, I'd love to have some forward movement. Crush at the workplace is very fun when you're physically going into the office because then you don't know when your crush is going to be in the kitchen, around the water cooler, but in a virtual world, it's kind of strange because your chances of seeing them is very intentional. You know when you're going to see your crush. You know, I was actually thinking that a virtual world would maybe make dating a coworker easier. Because, you know, the shit where you eat, that's a very real concern. To have to go in, let's say things turn sour. Let's say you date everything gets off to the right foot. Or even if it doesn't, let's say you're even tell the person you're interested and they don't return the sentiment. Either way, it's going to be fucking awkward to have to go into work every single day and see this. So if you're in a virtual world and you see them once a week, if even, and you can maybe even adjust your schedule that you see them zero, I think it's so much less awkward. And then also if you date, you know, you could just be in the same house on different computer screens and people wouldn't even know that you were dating, but also it could even if you're at your own home. It doesn't feel like you're spending every day together when you're only popping up on Zoom every once in a while. It's a little harder to develop a relationship, I guess. I think in person, the office romances I've seen have always been at office holiday parties, or something. Yeah, and you kind of you get in that context of being flirtatious. But over Zoom, it's a little bit harder to flirt, you know? Yeah. But I think the idea of dating coworkers is not a new concept. This is how people used to date and marry before the Internet because that is your network. So it kind of makes sense if you have feelings for a coworker because you've seen them more than once and you can develop that attraction over time. And also at work, it's kind of fun to see coworkers of how they react in different situations. Like how they handle pressure, how they handle leadership, how they handle presentations, and sometimes those scenarios can make someone a lot more attractive too. So let's talk about the legal aspect. A lot of companies do have a policy where you can't directly, you can't date your direct report. And that makes a lot of sense. It does affect your reviews and compensation, all of that you could be lawsuits. But I think companies at least in China. A lot of the companies actually prefer that you date each other because it keeps you longer at the company. Studies show that people who gain to relationships with their coworkers and eventually get married. Stay at a company twice as long as someone who didn't a coworker. So I believe that, but what happens when it goes sour? I'd want to get the fuck out ASAP. So I feel like that stat only works if it goes really well. Then the question is, how much do you like your job? Okay, so my take on this is I feel like when I was early in my career, I worked at Yahoo in Boston in so many couples came out of that office. People that got married, people that were just hooking up. I admit, I have hooked up with a coworker or two. Or three, I'll stop there. But yes, it was a prominent thing in this office. It was very incestual, which, you know, was good, obviously, for the people that got married. I mean, clearly it's someone that you have common interests with. You have similar ambition and drive. There's a lot of, again, reasons why it works. I feel like for the people that didn't necessarily work out with, it got a little gossipy and awkward. Oh, for sure. And I mean, it wasn't like the end of the world, but I remember, okay, this is gonna sound really bad, but I'll say it anyways. So, I hooked up with this guy that was an intern. But he actually was older than me. So he was not young intern. Like a B school intern. No, he was like a 6 or 7 year college student. Okay, never mind. So I remember, though, I had to give him a project to do, like a really shitty project. And I was like, I do not want to have to do this, but I can't tell my manager. I slept with the sky, so I can't give this project. So anyways, but there was also just like, it did get a little like high school vibe, college Y, like that, I didn't love.

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Anyways, I'm not gonna go too much into that. I think where it's changed is the me too era. I feel like you just don't hear as many couples that are beating at work. And this is pre-pandemic, nothing to do with the pandemic. Because now, if you hit on someone at work and it doesn't go your way, you are now a sexual harasser. And I think there's a lot of risk that comes with that, right? So this person that wrote in is kind of expecting that this guy is going to make the move. I would say if you're interested, it's almost like you should make the move because I think men especially hetero man are very gun shy to make a move at work. So I don't know if it's any indication if this person's interested or not if they haven't. I think we also need to be aware of just the climate that we're into. Yes. So how do you move something like this forward? I've seen this done where you, it's almost important that you have some sort of IRL event. So maybe you gather a group, a small group of your coworkers. Go out for happy hour or two go on a hike. So you're in a small intimate group four 6 people and when you're in that group and your crush is there, you focus your attention on him and you start talking to him and maybe just throw around like I never see you in person now that were virtual, we should do a one on one like a zoom one O one. Just like that. And then you can take it you can do the online offline online just go kind of ping Pong back and forth and just developing that connection. That way it's low stakes. You haven't said anything. I don't think it's necessary to be like, oh, I have feelings for you. You're still sussing it out yourself and they probably are too, and both of you are probably scared of what this could be. And if it didn't turn out the way you wanted to. So just take it baby steps and just ping Pong back and forth between online and offline. I think this is going to be a longer game. You're doing the long game here versus daily gaps where you meet, decide if you're going to date or not. This is definitely one that needs to play out. I do think though, you know, right where we are right this minute with going back to the office, but still not being fully back. People are ripe for connection. So people are very down to do happy hours right now. So I think the next time that you two are on the same day shift, make that happen. I think people are going to be receptive as long as there's advanced notice, and you'll also see clearly he might have plans that are unrelated, but if he's totally down to go get happy hour, then that's a good side, right? So I think you'll be able to understand a little from the reactions, not to say like if he can't one time, it means that he's not, but the more you can do these like you are saying just subtle ways to hang out and you'll see, is this person down to do it? Do they always have some excuse of why they can't do it? If you do the one on one, is it all about work stuff? Do they never deviate from work? Those might be signs. Also like, what is this person's status? Do you know for sure they're single? Yeah. Because I personally don't know if a lot of my coworkers are single or not. I have no idea. Yeah, or what sexual preference. There's so many factors. Yeah, no idea. Okay, let's hold that thought for a few messages. This episode is brought to you by drizzly. If you look for it, every day has cause for celebration, celebrate a friend for their promotion, baby, wedding life thing, celebrate yourself for keeping the couch warm. It's no easy feat, especially if it's a big couch. Or maybe you just want to celebrate living in 2022, where you can get beer, wine, and spirits deliver from drizzly in under 60 minutes without leaving, said, couch. No wonder drizzly is the number one app for alcohol delivery. 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If you're serious about finding your person, an eager to implement every step of the method, the sky's the limit, registration opens June 20th, but get on the wait list now, so you'll be able to sign up before the general public, because we will sell out. Just head to finding your person dot com to learn more. Again, that's finding your person dot com. Seeing someone outside of work can really change the context. So I think that's very important thing to do, but one word of caution. And I've seen this happen. I've never been victim to this, thank God, but I don't tell any of your coworkers that you have a crush on this person. You just don't do that. That's how gossip starts. And it's going to ruin everything for you. So just keep it to yourself. Just tell us a dateable podcast. These are the only people that need to know, but do not tell your coworkers. I'm really glad you said that because I feel like that's just going to make it feel like high school again. Yes. That's what you want to avoid. The gossip circle. You know, I definitely had coworkers at my current company that they don't work there anymore, but they did date for a while, and it was very under wraps, like no one really knew for a long time until they were serious, like living together serious. So I think if this was to progress, like having those types of conversations with your partner, there's another couple they were actually a couple before they worked here though. And they would be on the same calls and they would be in separate rooms because they live together, but they didn't want to seem like unprofessional where they're like on video calls together. So I think if you are going to date someone in the workplace, expect it to be different to your relationship. You're not going to be PDA, you're not going to be like declare your love as much because there's a lot of these factors out there. And you almost have to preempt the coming out announcement. You kind of, when you get to a place, you feel serious enough about each other. You just start telling people, get ahead of it. Don't let people gossip or guess what's happening, why are you guys showing up at the office together? We're on a same zoom call together just get ahead of it. I had this happen when I was dating a coworker. And when we DTR, we told everyone, like, just so y'all know, so you don't stop guessing, stop gossiping. We are dating, and then everybody shut up, because once you tell them, it's no longer gossip. And not interesting news for them. Wait, when did you date a coworker? Like in New York. When I was in Beijing, oh Beijing, okay. Yes. Yes. And it was a very gossipy group because it's like expats. Everyone's young and single. Wait, was this the guy you live with or someone different? No. Okay. That's very short lived relationship, but when we DTR, we were like, let's just tell everyone. And then they stopped talking about us. Okay, so short lived, was it awkward after? Not at all. Not at all. Yeah. It wasn't awkward 'cause people knew. I think people only get awkward if they don't think you know that they know. So they're trying to hide the fact that they know, but if everybody knows, whatever. Oh my God, I just thought of something really embarrassing that happened to me. I would do a quick sidebar on this. This is not the advice that anyone's looking for, but we had a holiday party when I worked at Yahoo back in the day. This was like, I don't know, a couple years out of college. And this is the one that was just a total gossip mill and everyone was hooking up with everyone. So we had our holiday party. That's when a lot of the shit would get go down. Because that's when people get drunk and all the stuff happens. Again, different climate that we're in today for many reasons, pandemic, and then even pre-pandemic. This was, I would say a good 15 years ago. So anyways, holiday party happens, somehow I end up leaving with the sky. That haven't really even talked to all that much. We had like a few interactions at work, but nothing crazy. And at the time, my roommate was a fellow coworker of mine. And her boyfriend was a coworker. So it was super incestuous. And we're on the way back to my place, like in a cab. This was before Uber. This was this long ago. I was hammered. I get out of the cat. I stopped the cab, because in my mind, I was like, oh my God, I'm bringing the sky back to them. This is so bad. I don't even know what I'm doing. They're going to see this. Yeah, yeah. So I tell the car to stop. I get out of the cab, no context of where I am. I'm like four blocks from my house. And then I'm just like lost. I see a cab coming back, so I hail it. I opened the door. It was a minivan, so I opened the door sliding door. He's there, because it was the same cab that just turned around. And he was like, oh, you changed your mind. And I slammed the door. And the next I was so mortified. The next day was one of those moments I woke up, and I was like, oh, you know, nothing bad happened last night, and I went to get on the tea the public transport in Boston to go to work.

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And I was like, oh fuck. And I remember seeing him that day and I was like, so awkward. And then I went out with my friends that night and he was at the bar and I was again super fucking awkward. Because I had no communication skills at all back then. So I was just like ran away. Like I ran for this guy multiple times. That's horrible. Well, you didn't sleep with it. So I didn't. I didn't. Good thing, I guess. I don't know. Anyways, there was a lot of, I could go on all day of all the stories that happened back at this job, but I think yeah, I think the world has changed a lot because I don't know. I just, did you hear as many of these, let's get drunk at holiday parties and hook up. I feel like that's not the world that we're in anymore. I mean, my coworkers still ask me if they can hug me. It's very different. There's no way. And even when we do go out drinking, it's not. Nobody's getting hammered. And if like a member, there was this guy at work that would touch women's backs and everyone thought he was like the creeper. So it wasn't flirty and nice. It was like this guy super creepy. So I think we're in a different world. We need to recognize where we are. I mean, that being said, I think if the connection is there, you should shoot your shot. I think you said it out before it is this job to you. That's probably the ultimate question. I mean, one of my old managers, he ended up marrying a girl that reported to him. So it does happen. I mean, that's clearly like, you need approval and stuff. But ultimately, they both left. They're just like, look, there's a dime a dozen tech companies. We don't need to work here. You know? Yeah, I mean, that's kind of the point too, is you can always find a job, but finding your life partner is not that easy. So which one do you prioritize more? And it doesn't mean that if things go sour, you're going to leave this job. It's not going to be that dramatic, just you have to weigh out your options a little bit before moving forward. But I don't see anything wrong with giving you a little nudge here and there and giving that giving that a sign of interest just to start. Yeah. It's so, it's so hard, because I'm like thinking about it. I'm like, I agree with you on some level. It's like, yeah, this person could be your soulmate, but they also could blow up in a week. It wasn't worth it, you know? It's just so hard to tell and jobs too. Like, yeah, you could find another job. It really just depends on you and your industry and what you do. There's so many factors that we can't give blanket advice for that. But I think it's weighing all the factors and then letting something progress over time. So when you are taking a risk, it's more of a calculated one. That's what I would say. Like don't shoot a shot blind and they're like, if you're a hetero, they're like, I'm gay like men, you know? Although that would probably just be funny. They would be like, I don't care. Yeah, I think just being more careful about it. But there's nothing. I think it's just figuring out what your feelings are and then developing a connection and seeing if there's a connection worth pursuing farther. Right. I mean, just like any kind of dating. If you do decide this, it doesn't have to be like, I want to get married to you. You can ease in on what it is that you're actually saying to this person, that it's not that big a deal if they were to reject you, quote unquote. Yeah, yeah. Okay, so dating a coworker, yay or day. What's your consensus? Yay. Yay. I was gonna say, I have kind of a middle ground. I think again, I'll go back to our takeaway. It's a calculated risk. Know that it's the long game. Really assess your situation, but if everything checks out and you think it's worth it, then yeah, of course this could be a very viable prospect. Don't expect instant results, and I think, again, the idea of the man pursuing in a hetero world may be outdated because of me too, not to be blamed. Oh, another way to do this, I just thought of this is if you see them on an app, swipe on them, and if you match, you kind of get an answer there, right? At least. That's ideal. But I don't know. I think that would be the best scenario, but I think also a lot of coworkers are afraid to swipe on each other on apps, but see what happens. Yeah, I mean, I think you can even just bring up dating, like more like instead of I want to date you, like just bring up dating so they know that one you're single. And then you can also see their reaction. If they're like, yeah, I live with my partner, then you don't need to waste any more time, right? Or you can plot how you're going to break them up. Just kidding. You're now sounding like a friend of ours. Oh my God, yes. Try to introduce us to a married man. She's like, I have a viable and I think it was like someone in her professional that worked too. She's like, I am a viable prospect for you. This is when both UA and I were sickle. She's like only problem. He's married with three kids. We're like, yeah, thank you. We were like, is he going to divorce or something? And she's like, I don't know.

00:25:05 - 00:28:06

I love thinking about his marriage. This is not a viable prospect for either one of us. Thank you. This is the least viable prospect. I'd rather date a coworker outright than date this man who's married with three kids. I think the best bet though would be your friend's coworker. Yeah. Someone that you don't shit where you eat, but they get the seal of approval. That would be good. Yes. Yes. Industry conferences, that's another good one. You know, people that are in your world, but not in your direct worlds. Yeah. If anybody listened to our main episode this week is about a family of three co parenting one child and the three of them all met separately at conferences. Yeah. So maybe that's a little inspiration for you. Maybe it's not your direct coworker, but someone in your industry. All right, cool. We gotta thanks for sending in the questions. We would love to get more questions. We love all the questions you've all sent in. You can email us. Hello at dateable podcast dot com or DMS on Instagram at data podcast. Okay, see you next week. Bye, all. The dateable podcast is part of the frolic podcast network. Find more podcasts you'll love at frolic media slash podcasts. Want to continue the conversation? First, follow us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter with the handle at dateable podcast. Tag us in any post with a hashtag stay dateable and trust us. We look at all those posts. Then head over to our website dateable podcast dot com. There you'll find all the episodes as well as articles, videos, and our coaching service with vetted industry experts. You can also find our premium Y series where we dissect, analyze, and offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums. We're also downloadable for free on Spotify, Apple podcasts, Google Play, overcast, stitcher radio, and other podcast platforms. Your feedback is valuable to us, so don't forget to leave us a review. And most importantly, remember to stay dateable. Introducing Under Armour's infinity high sports bra, it's ergonomic design is molded to support the natural movement of your body. With cord out padding, the better breathability eliminates extra bulk without sacrificing support. And quick dry padding is Under Armour's fastest drying padding yet. When you're lifting heavy, running fast and pushing yourself further than ever before, you need a bra that will help you go that extra mile and make you feel your best. Shop the infinity high sports bra now at UA dot com. U fo's active recovery footwear helped veteran quarterback Alex Smith get back to the highest level of football. We all have obstacles, challenges at different points in life. I still push myself every single day. The first time I put on a pair of it was like someone released the pressure when you are recovered that has a compounding effect on all aspects of your life. Stepping into a pair of their truly one of a kind. Tri uffo for yourself at U fo's dot com that's dot com. Dot com

#brunchtalk: Is there a future when one partner earns more than the other?

00:00:00 - 00:05:01

This episode is made possible by almond cow. Are you like me and can't really drink animal milk or maybe you prefer the taste of plant based milk? Well, almond cow makes it possible to make plant based milk at home with a comprehensive milk maker kit. And you can seriously make some yummy plant based milk without straining involved and it takes less than a minute. I recently made some delicious almond milk with simple clean ingredients, no more additives, fillers, or astronomical amounts of sugar. Almond cow milk is simply water and ingredients of your choice. Also, it's so affordable. You can go to the store and pay almost $4 for 64 ounces of plant based milk, where you can make 40 ounces at home for 55 cents. And think beyond just almond milk, you can literally milk any nut seed or grain of your liking. Plant based possibilities at the touch of a button for a limited time only on cows giving our listeners $25 off on all orders $200 or more. Go to almond cow to get started. Again, that's almond Cal dot CO and use your code dateable at checkout for $25 off. The dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that The Huffington Post calls one of the top ten podcasts about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about everything from sex parties to sex droughts, date fails to diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host UA shoe, former dating coach turned dating sociologist. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Kraft chick as we explore this crazy dateable world. Hello, Friends. Welcome to another episode of brunch talk brought to you by the dateable podcast. This is our Sunday fun day episode and we love bring these episodes to you because now we finally get to answer all the questions you all have been setting in. Oh my God, Sunday fun day. That just brought me back ten years to bottomless but both. I love that where you're mine went. I feel like Sunday, fun day was such a thing and you would start at 12 and be out till, I don't know, ten, 11. I never made it past then. I can't do it anymore. I can't do that. I'm in bed by like four if I'm day drinking and it ruins my entire night. Will the problem was that I would always stay out like ten 11 and I would go home, go to sleep and then wake up at like 4 a.m.. Yeah, yeah. Totally fucks with your assistant. But when you're in your 20s, it's cool. Oh my God. We exclusively sought out brunch spots that probably had terrible food to have bottomless mimosas. Yeah, with cheap champagne. Yeah, although recently, one of my friends had her birthday brunch, you know her very well. Our friend Mary. And she gets after it. She's now a mom of two. And she heard her husband got a hotel in the city. So I should have known better. It didn't register, but at her like 11 o'clock shots were coming out full force. So yeah. Okay, yeah. It was Sunday fun day. Saturday fun day. Yes. Sunday, Sunday, mommy fun day. I feel like the older you get, you gotta move to Saturday, so you have like a full day of recovery in the next one. Or I take Monday off. Yeah, exactly. If I know it's coming, I got a plan accordingly. Julie, I don't know if I ever told you this story about my bottomless mimosa story in New York. And I please give more details. There was a place in the East Village. I forget the name of it, but it was $20 for a bottomless mimosas. All the 25 year olds in the city would go every Sunday to get. Fucking trashed, and there was one time I was there, right before I came in, I noticed people kind of leaving in big groups and just looking like they were very distraught. I don't know what was happening. So I go in, nothing happened, you know, I have my bottomless mimosas. I get home, and in the New York Post, they had just updated the story about some guy who took a shit at that restaurant after doing like hours of bottomless mimosas and he didn't know he had shit his pants until another patron has smelled the shitty aroma. And they cleared out the restaurant. So this happened right before I got there. Can you believe this guy was so fucking trashed? He shat his pants and didn't even know it. Wow. I thought you were gonna say like he was with your group or something. Oh no. He would not be my friend. Anymore. That's just sad. And is that? I don't know if I told you this full story about the shots at this bride. Tell me more. But they came around for shots, and it was like 11, and my friend counted the number of people at the table, and I was like, I'm good, like my boyfriend and I are like, don't want one. Yeah. And the guy, like the waiter, because I don't like shots in general. And it was also, there were many reasons. So anyways, we're like, we're good, we don't want that. My boyfriend was in the bathroom at the time. So it was just me. And the guy's like, okay, ten shots. And I'm like, did you just hear me? No, clearly.

00:05:02 - 00:10:04

I don't want any. So anyways, I had to go to the bathroom, my wedded sod, and I told him, and I was like, hey, you can take two off. And he's like, I can't because they're already in the system, which is bullshit. But I was like, okay, then just bring them and I'll give them to someone else. So he comes by, brings the shots over. And he comes by and he comes over to my boyfriend and I first, and he's like, don't worry. It's good. And he gives us the shots. And we're like, okay, that's weird. And then he goes around and gives everyone else the shots. Like forgot like two shots. I'm like, what is going on here? Comes back and then I'm like looking confused and he's like, don't worry, it's water. So he really given a shot so we could like part of the group. So anyways, we give the chairs whatever. My boyfriend takes his shot. It's fine. I take mine. I'm like, this does not taste like water, like this tastes tequila. And I'm like, keep sipping it 'cause I'm like, is this water or tequila? And then this guy next to my boyfriend. He's like, guys, I think I've just been going out too much 'cause this shot tastes like water. So this guy, like the waiter. He like fucked up his own plan. And then they're like, why would they give water shots? 'cause everyone was so confused. I don't know, the whole thing was awkward, and then finally my friend asked the waiter. And he's like, oh yeah, I didn't want them to feel left out. She's like, why didn't you guys say they're watered? I'm like, I don't know. This whole thing happened. And I wasn't part of it. It just happened. What if I was pregnant or something? Like, he can't fuck up that plan. That's terrible. We're allergic or you're an alcoholic. There's so many things. We were trying to feel left out. We told them we were good. We could have cheered our regular water. Yeah, yeah. Fired. Well, help all your brunches are going a little better than that. Make sure you're getting what you asked for, whether that's tequila or water. Ahead of time. Let's get into our question. It's not related to this at all, but I don't know, tequila could help in the situation. The question is, what do I do if I'm having doubts in my relationship? A little bit more details, this person says I've been with my partner for a little bit over a year and a half and we have a large pay discrepancy in the beginning, I didn't think it was a big deal, but now it's starting to be a point of contention for us. I'm starting to doubt if there is long-term potential with this partner, what do I do if everything else is going well? Well, you know, there's always going to be something. I think that's first and foremost. There's always going to be always. Well, and everything else is everything else is not going well if this is what's bothering you, right? We can't think like this is separate from everything else. This does bleed into every other aspect of your relationship. Yeah, I mean, I think the reality is that things haven't changed, right? This is something you do from day one. So it needs to be can I fully accept my partner for who they are or is it that much of a problem that I need to leave and find someone that's a better match for me at that? Knowing that there may be other areas that they're not a better match, right? So no one is perfect. No one is going to check all the boxes, but ultimately only you know how essential one thing is. I think the worst case is staying and feeling like resentment about it. Yeah. Like that is the worst. I think you need to either get over it and just be like, I'm gonna be the primary breadwinner with today's world. If it's woman or man, whoever, like there's no shame in that, like everyone is on a different page. Or no it's a deal breaker for you. Yeah, the issue here is that in early dating, we tend to overlook some of these issues that we make encounter later in our relationships because these are more for long-term compatibility and then in early dating, you're like, everything's great, anything goes. This person's fun, they're nice. We're having a good time. And when you hit that year mark or year and a half mark, I think that's when you start thinking, um, could this be long-term? And I've personally haven't been in this situation but I've had many friends, many girlfriends who have who are high powered positions, doctors, lawyers, whatever, and they marry or are in relationships with men who don't make nearly as much, maybe one third, what they do. And I think what has worked for them is this open communication about it. I think what doesn't work is when you, like you said, Julie, when you have the resentment, or when you start thinking, when are they going to get a higher paying job? You don't actually say it to them. You're just waiting for things to happen. Right. It doesn't work like that. The relationship that I've seen work, they have an opening communication say, if this high pay discrepancy between us is going to continue. How do we want to do our finances if we were to get married? How do we want to raise our children? How do we want to upkeep our lifestyle? And you have to agree on these terms.

00:10:04 - 00:15:16

And maybe sometimes the other person says, okay, well, actually, I do want to make more money because I think we should be on the same page where they go, you know what? I want to contribute more in these other ways. But it has to be discussed is such an individual problem. Yeah, I love that what you said. You can't force people to do something different. You know, and also just started occupations just pay differently. So it doesn't even mean that it's a reflection of their ambition or drive or anything like that. So I would also maybe challenge this person that wrote in to think about like, what is it that's really bothering me? Is it like the prestige of their job? Is it the actual dollar amount? Is it that I feel like they're lazy? You know, like, I don't know, like what is it that's really bothering you because just the blanket like they don't make enough that it could be any of those things. The reverse to think about what your partner's feeling, they don't want to feel inadequate. They don't want to feel like they're less than. So if you're not communicating this, you sure as hell are probably going to show it in a relationship. It's not going to make them feel good. And know that anything could happen in the future. I always say that the future is so unpredictable. My friend was dating an artist and he was completely broke, but then was able to sell one painting for 40 grand one month. You know, you just never know with different occupations when they may hit the jackpot or you could also lose your job and be without any income for a while. So ultimately, have to look at the core of the foundation of the relationship, is it suitable for a future? And be on the same page about the core values that you find are important. Yeah, I do go back to not everyone will have every last thing on your checklist. I think that we just have to accept that. That is a truth of it. There's always going to be something. Always, no matter what, if you do end this relationship, then find someone that has the high paying job, there's going to be something else that's a challenge. So of course, how can we work through this and how can we see this person for the good that they bring to the relationship? Because I really think focusing just on the negatives is set up for failure. And if that is what you're finding yourself doing, then it may be time to let this relationship go, because yeah, it's not fair. Like you were saying, it's not fair to the other person to be held to the standard. You know, we talked about this once on a podcast that we did with Alexandra Solomon. It stuck with me is that every relationship there's going to be conflict is just going to show up in a little different way. So if you're just getting out to escape what you're currently in, that's going to come back to bite you in a different form. So before you throw in the towel here, really look at what this relationship means holistically. Yeah. In my experience, what's so important in all of this is to maintain respect for your partner is as soon as the respect is gone, everything is gone. Yes. So if you are seeing your partner is lesser than you don't really think they have a real job or you don't think they can live up to your lifestyle standards. That's so dangerous and toxic because you're always going to see them as inferior to you. So it's important in these situations. Maybe even couples counseling would be good is to equalize a relationship so that you don't feel this disrespect for your partner, which will ultimately end in really bad, just bad results. I agree, respect is so foundational and it doesn't need to be money all the time. If that's the case, look at your partner and say, is this an intellectual equal? Is this someone I can learn a different things from, that I don't know? They challenged me in some way. It doesn't always have to equate. I feel like sometimes we equate money to how intelligent someone is or how successful they are, even success doesn't always equate in terms of dollar amount. So I would encourage you to think about what are some other ways that you can see the values that you're really looking for within this person that isn't necessarily just like a number. Something that's kind of personal to both you and I is we do this podcast. Yes, we have a full time day job. What if we only did this podcast and you were with a partner who's like, oh, you just do a podcast and you don't make enough to make a living. I don't think I could be with someone like that because it's podcast is our baby. It means so much to us. Maybe we're not making so much money right now to sustain ourselves, but at least it's something that we really truly love. And I met up with friend the other day and he was introducing me to someone. He's like, oh, she has a podcast on the side. I'm like, no, it's not a podcast on the side. He's like, but you don't make a full-time living on it. I like it doesn't matter, right? It doesn't matter the money amount. So I think that's also important to talk about with your partners like, what are their passions? And what are they working towards to? And for anybody who has dismissed you and I for doing this podcast, I'm like, what if one day we become these multi millionaires with this fucking empire of a business, which is what we're building, what are they going to say then, right? You didn't expect this, but you didn't respect us enough.

00:15:16 - 00:20:00

Not what if, when? When we become. When? No, but that would just hit so hard if someone felt that way. So hard. But also it goes back to how do you measure success, right? Like, you know, we've been on the top of the charts. We reach so many people. It helped them through their personal lives. There's so much success in there that doesn't correlate to dollars at all. So yeah, I think the worst thing can be to not address it and to put them down in some way. Ultimately, we need to accept our partners for who they are, whether it's money or some other quality, we can not bank on potential. That is a surefire way to not let a relationship grow into build resentment. Ali Wong, perfect example. Oh my God. She married for a stability and then she got famous and rich and look at her now. They're divorced. Her whole comedy special is how she dreams of cheating on him and then she's like, I'm divorced. But can you imagine like, I don't know her personally, obviously, and I don't know much about her background with her ex-husband. But can you just imagine the type of ridicule she got? When they were dating, I'm sure her family was like, you're dating a what? A stand up. You know, she's not going to make any money. That's not a respectable job. And he probably thought the same thing. It was like, I'm marrying an artist. Let's see what happens. Little did they know? Yeah. I think though we can't it's so easy to be like, but what if maybe they'll turn into this superstar, but I think you have to really take at face value what is happening because yeah, again, we really need to be I think going off potential is the most dangerous thing you could do at a relationship. Yeah, you go off to intent. So if you're dating someone who is a deadbeat, I don't ever want to work. Right. It's going to be a stay at home, whatever. Not even a stay at home parent, but just to stay at home. Stay at home, watch TV. Do nothing, yeah. I want to be a professional Netflix watcher, then maybe that doesn't coincide with your core values. But if you are dating someone who's like, hey, I'm still chugging along in my career. I have these goals in mind. I am motivated. I'm just not where I want to be right now, then that's all you can really ask for is the intent. Yeah. So for anyone that caught last week's episode, it was when you know you know. So you're pretty sure. But my counter to that is I did read this article that basically, it's okay to never be a 100% sure. Yeah, you'll never be a 100% sure, because there's always going to be a side of you that thinks like, what if, you know, that's normal. And instead of fighting that, I think, yeah, all the stuff we talked about, but on this episode is really important to get to a place of respect, but also don't beat yourself up if you're not feeling like, oh my God, I know, in my core, a 110%, like that is also A-okay. Yeah. Potential. Okay, so what are some of our key takeaways on this? Don't date for potential. It's number one. Yeah, don't date for intent. Don't date for potential. And if you are having doubts with your partner, the first person to talk about these issues with is your partner. And get to the root of what the doubt really is, because sometimes we almost mask it in something else that really isn't the true doubt and we say their career isn't as lucrative as mine. Like what does that really mean? Ask the why, then ask the why again and the why again. Why, why, why, why, why? All right, that is it for this episode. We are done with our bottomless talk. I was just saying everyone's enjoyed their Sunday Friday and pondering about what to do when you've doubts in your relationship. Maybe don't have 5 mimosas and then start talking about that. Yeah, let's sleep alcohol out of this. Alcohol just creates more doubt. For anybody. And we will see you all back here next Sunday for another episode of brunch talk in the meantime, send us your questions hello at dateable podcast dot com or DM us on Instagram at data podcast. See you next week. The dateable podcast is part of the frolic podcast network. Find more podcasts you'll love at frolic media slash podcasts. Want to continue the conversation? First, follow us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter with the handle at dateable podcast. Tag us in any post with a hashtag stay dateable and trust us. We look at all those pose. Then head over to our website dateable podcast dot com. There you'll find all the episodes as well as articles, videos, and our coaching service with vetted industry experts.

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You can also find our premium Y series where we dissect, analyze, and offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums. We're also downloadable for free on Spotify, Apple podcasts, Google Play, overcast, stitcher radio, and other podcast platforms. Your feedback is valuable to us, so don't forget to leave us a review. And most importantly, remember to stay dateable. Civil rights are as relevant now as ever. Listen to the South Carolina legacy of courage podcast, featuring people who stood strong against oppression. The legacy of courage podcast explores 19th century events, and then illuminates court cases, protest, and those who affected positive change in South Carolina. And nationally. Visit SC legacy of courage dot com to learn about South Carolina's civil rights journey. Hi everyone, it's doctor Mark Harrison, president and CEO of intermountain healthcare. I'm excited to introduce my new podcast called a healthier future. I'll be speaking to innovative leaders exploring big ideas for transforming and improving the future of health and wellness. We'll also be tackling topics such as leadership, career journeys, work life integration, and how to make good trouble to drive social change. You can listen to this exciting new podcast on any major platform. And while you're there, we'd love to hear what you think of our show. Thanks for listening.