You all know that guy that's fiercely independent, has a revolving door of casual flings, and whose family and friends have determined will never settle down. Well, we're talking to Yue's friend Jesse who was just like this...until he wasn't. Join us as we hear from him and his now-wife Cassie about how they went from being in a totally uncommitted relationship to being married. We discuss what happens when that light goes off that you want something more substantial, the risks that you're willing to take for the right person, and how to be as full of an individual before finding your other half.
Thank you to our partners for this episode:
Gobble: Get 6 meals for $36 plus free shipping visit gobble.com/dateable
CloudPaper: Get your environmentally friendly toilet paper for 15% off your first order use the code DATEABLE at https://cloudpaper.co/
S12E5: Is it the Right Person or the Right Time?
00:00:01 - 00:05:06
The Dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that the Huffington post calls one of the top ten podcast about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about. From sex parties to sex droughts, date fails a diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host Yue Xu, former dating coach turned dating sociologists. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Krafchick as we explored this crazy dateable world.
Hello everyone welcome to another episode of dateable a show all about modern dating where we get to the bottom of. Why people do the things they do when it comes to dating. We want to know the why why why this has been a great first week of like i think reopening feel like everyone's out and about now. Yeah but it's ironic because we're hitting literally a year bark for when this all started so happy to week anniversary slashed one year. Of what we are. You remember those days and everyone's like oh. This will be done in two weeks. Oh i never said that. I never said i was like this is going to be six to eight months. That was my guess. Yeah you did. And i was like. Don't say that but here we are but no. It's definitely like a different vibe. For sure. Like i feel like last weekend. I kind of oversight felt like it was like a similar vibe going out wise to pre covid yes people were like out but it felt just like much more congested and like the bar scene was like kinda crazy in a mike. Actually kinda lights life needs to. Obviously i don't want the disease at all that and the fear going out. But i think for me. I realized that. I hit. Like i mean i kind of realized pre covid. That kind of outgrew. Some of the party life. That i want stayed and i feel like it's a weird place because i'm like single but like don't want to be doing like single type behaviors. Kind of i know there was actually this quote. I found it. Put it on instagram. This up exactly how. I feel so much to pull it up per second. A case people aren't following us this reminder but it was. I don't miss bars. But i do miss going somewhere with the potential to beat someone. No i actually never met anyone but still that sums it up because it's like in your mind you're like if i'm sitting at home watching like like i can't beat anyone but then what you're there like. You actually meet anyone. But anyways. I think what people do like about going out is always the possibility woodley. Never know in a gives you this false sense of abundance like there's a lot of options out there because you see them out and about but the success rate is pretty damn low at least in my book. Yeah i mean like like. I've taken inventory of like pass boyfriends and i mean i have met people through friends of friends like at mars so i do think there is a viable path that way but i cannot recall since college like after college like a time where someone random came up to me in the bar. It became something. Like i literally count on my hands the times that's happened. Yeah i mean nothing. More than a casual make out. Yeah maybe it. I mean that's a good segue to our episode this week. Is this episode. We definitely i mean. We talked to you. As fred's i want you to give people the back story. A little t want here. But what part of it was like this whole thing like you know just the evolution of your own self to like. He started off. You would describe as more of like a player type muck boy baby as the term. Now you know like someone that's just not really you don't see commitment oriented but now he's married so there is obviously an evolution. That happened and i think one of the questions. We pose on this episode or just in general. That's comes up. All the time is like is it the right person or the right time that kind of like switches that for people. He is the anomaly that we've always wanted to understand right. He is the guy that i've known jesse ever since he just graduated from college so ever since he was like just entering into his adult world. And i'm good friends with his older sister. Remember thinking this kid. At the time he was just a kid. This kid is going to be trouble because he was like hating on. All of her friends have so much confidence. No qualms about approaching women and a few years later. My friend was like oh jesse's doing really well. He moved to san francisco very successful and really like just loving the nightlife there. And i remember telling. Ju ju julie about his sister's name is julie joe. I tally you julie about him. I was like this guy is trouble. I knew he was going to be trouble. He wasn't even the type of player who would try to trick you into a relationship and then send peace out.
00:05:06 - 00:10:02
He he was just so honest. Like listen i'm not looking for relationship. I'm writing for fun. And girls just flock to him even though list so noncommittal. In every time i met up with him huby with a different girl who was just swooning over him obsessed with him trying to change him and he was just so honest like listen. I'm not trying to get down. And then i finally had to text are julian. I was like julie i have. Some news jesse's engaged hustle. And i don't know jesse. Avi i bet awards one of your classes but i remember like all these years you would always like use him as the example of like you know like that guy that got tons of girls but like didn't want to settle down so when you did tell me i was like oh interesting Yeah just you know things things do shift for people. And i think that actually isn't interesting moment because like i don't know about you but i can actually pinpoint the time that it did shift for me when i went from not wanting a relationship to wanting a relationship and i mean to the question. Is it like the right time. The right person. Like listen to this episode but jesse's future wife they did meet in this stage so i think there is kind of an element of both. I think definitely was her. That pushed him to change. But i also think that like you could point and say like well. He met her years ago so obviously some of it was the place where he was in. I think travel like we talked about this on the episode that he did take this time to travel and i think that does change people a lot in idaho. I have like a good friend that took time abroad. Came back and was like okay. I'm ready for like a serious relationship. Now and i think sometimes like when you get out of your system. That's like when things change for you. Like i know for me when i first moved to ask like i had zero desire to be at a relationship like honestly like i would. I mean i hooked up with people. I would like go out like i had friends with benefits like hit this guy actually from my high school which was super ironic but it was like just what i needed when i moved across the country. Because it's kind of like a reminder in that mistake like knock committee all. But i wasn't looking for that like i wanted to just like build a life for myself make friends go out and i'd like hit him up to. Am and i was totally fine with it and then one person did shift me. I did date him for a bit. But it wasn't something like a serious relationship. But i think some of it was like i was more settled in my life at that stage when i did have that shift and i remember dislike cuddly with having this was like someone those more like a casual relationship with. I remember like cuddling and be like. Oh i actually like like this. And i like this and that ling definitely propel me to like use like match dot com back in the day like really start to actually like an adult Interesting i've pondered this question for so long now. Because i really feel like my boyfriend right now is so similar to my boyfriend at twenty five so i kinda went full circle but when i was twenty five. I didn't appreciate all the that you offered. Also i kept thinking. What else is out there. I'm only twenty five. I'm about to settle down with the sky. And that's why when he proposed to me. I had that very visceral reaction of no. I'm not settling down yet. But i think once i got to a point where i felt like i had seen things and i had done things. I was ready for something more consistent than the right person came along after the timing piece was set into place so to me it felt like timing came first and then the person. Yeah well i actually found this like honestly hide this love to use like tiktok by spare time. Julie is all about the tiktok. I've literally differ. Like i posted like once or twice on our dateable cow. But i don't like some of that goes outta bakes tick talks. I just think it's one of those like weird single behaviors. That i like do in my spare time when i'm bored. I'm just like what are these people do out there. You are talks. Ideal customer sears. Like you're always on it. You share it you. Don't you're not trying to get famous on tiktok. You're really use it as an entertainment platform this a little bit of a tangent but deavere that sex of the city episode where like carries moving in with aiden. And she's like. Oh my god now. I have to cover up my like weird single behavior over. Yeah i don't know. Have you ever felt that way with your curb boyfriend. But i was thinking about the weird shit. I do alone and mike definitely endlessly like scrolling tectonics just like laughing to myself as pretty kind of funky weird like maybe like. I was with someone that we can do it together whether it be as weird but that is i also have like a total lacroix obsession like addiction. I wanna say. Because i used to drink diet coke and i phased that out completely which is great.
00:10:03 - 00:15:00
That's good now. I replace it with like bubbly water. But the thing is like i will forget to finish it and then it will get flat so i'll have another one just like constantly going through them. Actually maybe this is weird single behavior. Because like i like but my ex was like court. Tv with me. He's like. Oh i don't think we have enough lacroix here like we're not we're not gonna survive this quarantine. Those are my basic julie latter. Mike wow i sound funky basic behavior. Did you have anything that you like were like i can't do this now. I mean the only thing that i've been called out on is i love to drink out of different glasses and then leave them. Just leave stuff in there. Still like i can never finish a glass of water or a glass of wine. I always leave a little bit. Something at the bottom and it comes from this really strange childish behavior where i used to think like their bugs at the bottom of mike glass so i would never drink the bottom of it because i found a bug once when i was like sex that i will never drink the bottom of mcglasson. Just leave shit around and my boyfriend was like. Do you have enough glasses. Are you going to drink finish. But i've been called out on that before too but have. My mother also caused me out of the unfinished crisis similar finish. That's the problem. I don't finish it then. It gets open another one in your lacroix. Waste of i That's why up. There was so much fun anyways. Very tangent but odd by wake up and look at tiktok actually saw something for matthew hussy that i thought whistling actually so relevant to this episode of my ki- like read my mind that we're about to do this intro but i had a video. That said right person is both right and ready. He doesn't believe in the one that people can become the one who is right for you. So he's basically like say like when you have this like is it the wrong person. A right person wrong time conversation like they're essentially never going to be the right person because you need to be right and ready. So i've definitely fallen victim to that that i'm like oh it's the right person but we're just like not in the right time. I mean i've obviously tried to restart things with my smo- sirius x. Multiple ties because of that. And i think like taken to realize like it's never going to be the right person like the timing doesn't ever seem to resolve the stuff so yeah i think with this like this episode like. I think there's definitely an element of right person enwright time. There is something that i've been talking to some of my coworkers about recently. Is this mentality of win. Other things in your life are not going as planned. You take it out on the thing that is going well so even when you meet the right person and you do want to be with them. If other things in your life are not going the way that you really want them to go you will sabotage that relationship. Because it's the one thing that is going well and you feel like you can take it out on them so i do think the timing also comes from you feeling really good about where your life is today and then you're able to foster a much healthier relationship. Oh a hundred percent like one hundred percent like i know for myself personally but then also like the examples of my acts. That was guess right person wrong time but maybe wrong person overall. If you're gonna look at it that way it had nothing to do with our relationship. All of it was his own personal stuff in like obviously not gonna go into what that was but like now for me when i'm looking for a partner. Someone that is happy in their current life is like a huge thing. I'm looking like i think it's the balance of your happy in your current life. But you're willing to make room for someone and that actually is a hard balance to find. And i've been noticing it a lot during this quarantine like i. I don't know why. Keep saying quarantined. Like or not even gonna be twenty twenty one like i have no perception of time any war but like this whole life isn't as normal time. I guess i'll call it that. I think there's a lot of people using dating apps that are bored and like feel unfulfilled are using it to fill time. And i think for me. I'm like i don't wanna be with that person. Like i want to be with the person that's like likes their life as it is like has a great like base of friends and family and support outside of romantic but they also want to make room for that romantic person. Because i've also come across. The people are just damn busy and like that doesn't work either. Y- you almost want the person i mean you. I wouldn't say you want the person you should be.
00:15:00 - 00:20:01
The person were who's not trying to fill a void or looking for someone to come into your life to make things better. You should be in a place where you are so feeling so good about things you want to share these things with someone and i think i found personally for myself when i really want to share memories and experiences with someone. That's when i really meet someone special totally. Yeah i did. I guess like we could debate the right person right time all day long. But i'm gonna go in now with this mindset of the right person is also the right time I like that. It's a good discussion to have because it makes you take inventory of your previous relationships. How did you get them. What were you doing. What was your life like at the time that you were in that relationship. It's a good way to kind of analyze. Like your your behavior patterns. I guess yet. I think like also like this episode like i mean jesse is definitely like that. Quick essential personnel. That like did not give dating that much. thought right. like he definitely was intentional about the way he approached. Cassie his wife for sure but he was not like intentional about like going on dates to find a relationship to find marriage and i thought his perspective was actually really good. Because i i mean. I think there's multiple varieties of men and women. So this is like over generalizing. But i do think are two core people. There's like the people that like fall into relationships when it is the right time for them and then there's the people that are like so proactively looking for relationships. It's like kind of like what you're saying the balance of being open but not so open that you're like don't have a life like if your entire life revives around. Eating like people are going to see that. There is a point in this interview with jesse where we say. You broke all the dating rules. And he's like i did he. He's just like i had no idea. There were even dating rules. I really love because he he wrote his own rules. He wrote his own way of dating. And he comes like you were saying juliet like. There's no preconceived notions about dating. He basically was like. I'm not going to get married until proven otherwise. And he got proven otherwise so it's a great conversation. He is the guy. I wish i would have known when i was going through that serial dating loop and trying to get out. I wish i had heard this story. That because i think it would have made me feel a lot lot better about taking things so personally For sure cool so should we do a quick announcements this week. Yeah we have a livestream. This thursday so definitely check it out. This is available for all our community members in the love and the time of corona group. It's going to be at five thirty pm. Ps t eight thirty pm. Es t just for half an hour. It's a quick check in to really great way to dislike kind of live chat with all your community members people have said. It's like the chat on steroids before so it's always like a really fun time So that's one announcement other announcements that we have quickly is that we recently dropped new audio in our series for the sounding board all about managing setbacks which i feel like is actually like we didn't even plan at this way but i feel like it's the perfect follow on for genesis episode last week of data trauma which got an overwhelming response. If you haven't listened to that will definitely get on that and then also in the sounding board just to other things that are coming up we have. Logan jury is actually going to be gracing us with her presence in the book club. Do club every month and usually we don't have the authors come to the book club. It's at gisela. One of our hosts in the sounding board. She wanted to do a book club so we kind of put her in charge of the book club but this month she'll actually be joined with logan herself. So if you've read how to not die alone by logan jury. We had her on the podcast. A couple episodes. And you're in the sounding board awesome definitely. Check that out this coming thursday after the livestream. And if you're not in the sounding board yet you can go to dateable podcasts dot com slash sounding board definitely. Want to check it out. 'cause we also have ken page who were crowd favorites coming to the dateable after show. Yeah you can get all the information there. You've probably heard us talk about the sounding board many times. But if you're new definitely go the website and check it out and if you've been on the edge maybe this is the time it's a lot of good stuff coming up. I understand that if you're new coming into our podcast. This is really overwhelming. What's sounding board. Whose can age. How should i not die alone. I think it's a good time to acknowledge like first of all. Thank you so much for being a new listener. We always love having new listeners. To keep us in check to right to keep our perspective fresh and if you have any questions about any of these offerings feel free the dm us we can be found on facebook. You can see through the facebook app or you can find us on instagram and condemn us there.
00:20:01 - 00:25:03
We actually check all of the messages. And if you have any questions regarding anything that we do that is the place to do it. Yep all right amend shall we go to our sponsors. Let's do it. This episode is made possible by one of our favorites. Better help. thank you so much better help for sponsoring this episode. What are some things that you like to change in your life to find more happiness. What do you think is preventing you from achieving these goals. The simple answer at least in our is. Is you gotta prioritize your mental health. We dateable are huge fans of therapy and better help match you with your own licensed therapist and connect you in a safe and private online environment. I was able to start communicating with my therapist and less than forty eight hours. So boom you get connected and you're ready to go that help is committed to facilitating great therapeutic matches and it's more affordable than traditional offline counseling. They're licensed professional. Specialize in everything from stress set-backs dating trauma so for the new year. We wish for all of you to live a happier life. And that's why as a listener you'll get ten percent off your first month by visiting our sponsor at best help dot com slash dateable. Join over one million people who have taken charge of their mental health again. That's better help. H. e. l. p. dot com slash. Dateable awesome okay. So shall we get to jesse and cassie story. I know you're all waiting for it. Can't wait let's go. Love works in very mysterious ways. And sometimes it's we can't explain it and for our guests for the episode. I guess as someone who's watched their love story unfold. There are a lot of holes that are missing in my head of. How do i connect the dots and also a lot of weight. What moments like. How did this happen. When did this happen. So we're going to get to the bottom of it but end of the day. We're trying to get to the story of how to people when from a solid friendship to now happily married and so in love. So i we've got jesse he is he is. I've known jesse. For a long time. And i would have described jesse his single days as noncommittal playboy. Who had shit ton of fun who i thought was just out there to explore the world and to explore the dating life internationally. Not just in the. Us he's an international man of mystery. He early lives in carmel. He's thirty two years old originally from orange county. A he is now married married jesse. Let's let's definitely lockdown in a very good way yes absolutely. I am so curious to hear how you went from playboy to commit it like. What was your life before. Cassie has someone coming fresh on this. Well yeah i mean that's fairly accurate I always had the mindset right after college of. I'm not gonna get into a serious relationship unless i was really crazy about the girl i just didn't see the point i saw a lot of my friends aren't in these sort of half ass relationships where they were like you know lukewarm. And they're like this is great. This is convenient. But i just didn't see the point that i never did I didn't really have a true serious girlfriend in college or after college. And certainly my parents and some friends who are a little bit like married to settle down like what. What's your deal like. Are you just going to travel the world and e single. But i guess a good place to start would be a while. I was living in san francisco. I had actually met cassie And we had a What i call the time a very ideal relationship. Which was you know kind of a no strings. Attached very casual dating those types of friends not just friends and we were on the same page At least in the start it was great. I always felt she was a really cool girl. But my head was never in a place of you know this could potentially be a relationship material. I was just like just having fun. And actually that's that's the kind of relationship that dating experts warn you. That would never blossom into a real relationship. Is that right. You prove them. Wrong jesse so this was This is about two thousand and fourteen. We met And so went on dates this in that in the start. You'll talk to her later. So you'll get you'll get her side of it but It's sorta it was an off and on kind of thing And then finally you know she was basically like you're not gonna get serious about this.
00:25:04 - 00:30:20
Go kick rocks. I'm not at the time. I was like well. You know little sad. 'cause i did like your deep down inside. I didn't really know how to access that part of my brain or body them. But i let it go and i was like okay. Well she's someone. I think would be worth staying friends with right now. This is about twenty sixteen decide to leave the united states to go travel. The world and i was gone Completely i moved out everything And twenty sixteen and we stayed in touch. You know just the same way. You would stay in touch with a friend over instagram or snapchat or text message you know exchanging a photo here. Text there and everything like that and it was interesting because now our relationship has sort of shifted where in the beginning it was almost entirely. You know very physical and not so much substantial or conversational There was that but it wasn't. You know so much of that. And now you have where we literally can't be next to each other or separated by many miles and so we just start chatting and sending each other articles in. Just you know talking about this talking about that. Talking about wine line was a big part of our conversations. We sort of always liked it but we started started getting into it On a deeper level more and more cassie getting do a wine clubs back home going to napa. I was visiting different wine regions around the world and getting really really into it and really really drunk i. That was what i like. Best about line was getting drunk of course but now is it was actually learning about it. I was in tasmania australia. Chatting with these winemakers understanding such about the soil on about the flavors in their passion was exuding in. I was absorbing and it was so awesome. So i'm going all these great wine regions around the world. Australia zealand in europe and south america. And how do i save this wine. I'm no matter. I have a backpack right. You know can't really bring this wine home and some casually chatting with cassie and she cycle. Why don't we just split a case you send me a case i this great wine fridge at home also store half the bottles you know so i get half you get half. She has access to all these great wine regions. I have a place to store. it's great. this is amazing. This is a great little partnership so started in riyadh and spain and i would send her a a case of wine home and she would store and we'd split it And then the next place new zealand and the next place South america and so and so on and so on and we had this little collection going and and overtime. I was realizing like wow heard and i have a lot in common. I mean clearly wind passion in in one. But like everything like humor and smarts and the way that we would talk about different articles new yorkers and cartoon sending memes like this is. This is something here. This is pretty cool. And you know here. I am traveling. The world meeting tons a new people learning tons about myself. And what i want later in life and i'm like damn. This is something. I probably should pay a little bit. Closer attention to jesse was so funny because while you are traveling the world. Because i'm friends with jessie sister. I remember talking to her. We were texting back and forth. And i was like i. Just don't see jesse ever be locked down because he is traveling the world. He's a free bird. He is just exploring the world by himself and any girl who can really get with jesse would have to be on board with his lifestyle. She was like i know our whole family has given up on him. And i remember telling you. Julie like jesse s gone wrote but look in a good way. Jesse's out exploring the world. And i just i think he's going to be a lifer when it comes to his bachelorhood. So jesse out curious like watch like did you. How did you see yourself shifting like do you think it was the travel. Do you think it was like where do you think it was. That went like you were just saying that. Maybe there's more that you want with casts. I all talk to you as point. You're not alone with thinking that Forever you know bachelor and travel around the world and you know what i was. I was starting to get okay with that and get comfortable with that. I really was i. I thought that you know what if the right girl doesn't come along. And i don't have you know feelings of trying to get married then soviet. It's i would rather have that and be solo my whole life. Why solo travel the world then compromise and settle for something. That is not everything. I want so i was okay with that. Now julia to your to your point. When did i know there. There are a couple of key moments in our journey together. The first was. We agreed that we would go on a cruise to antarctica just as friends And actually a few other friends for joining us to be like a trip So there is that then later on there was. I threw a birthday party in and had invited her and There was a lot of our friends there and everything and it was one of the first times that we were back in the same area after traveling around the world and coming back and so now you have all this you know these exchange tax and now actually putting it all together.
00:30:20 - 00:35:14
That's what i was starting to hit home like. Wow you know the attraction still there the attraction piece which is so important right. That's their plus all this other amazing connection that we had developed remote. You know almost like a you got mail situation where you're chatting a modern day you got me on such vision and it was at that point i was like wow shit like this is this could be this. Could totally change my life thinking back then and then. It was some more time away. Six seven months later on that cruised antarctica. Actually i decided to change directions in life and that was it. No more traveling. I was going to do what it would take to be. Cassie and i said. I laid my cards table instead. This is it this. Is you know. I'm prepared to change everything and move in with you and move home with you. And yeah she was. She was stationed in san francisco with her job. So you know. She wasn't going to travel. The world. And i was okay with that because i knew that was the most important thing our relationship traveling will always be there and i did it now. Nonstop for two years and it was amazing. And i kept going for sure. I mean made it to seventy countries you know hundred plus more whatever but that relationship that we had established was more rare and more unique. I needed to really pay attention to that. And so that was. That was the end of Nomad jesse and he came home so there wasn't really like a pivotal. Like oh i need to be in a relationship was more just like i'm really just loving being in talking to cassie and i just bought her in my life. I didn't need to be in relationship. I needed to be in relationship with her. That was the difference. Well the way he the way you just described this whole experience traveling the world will always be there. That will always be an option. The world is not going anywhere but being with cassie may not always be there. So you it to really grab this opportunity and put some urgency behind it. That is really fascinating it. Did you guys have any like talk about being more. Romantic up until at antarctica tripper Would you laid it all out or was not the first time nope that was. That was the first time where i was. Just now. we're sort of there and just like had that conversation where you know. I was fully expecting or prepared for her. Say no you wanna get you say cisco what are you talking about like. I figured i might as well be vulnerable. Lay it on a line because why not worse it can happen and she says now and okay. You know it sucks. But i would. I'd have my life to go back to. And i travel the world and keep doing that but in the event that she felt the same way than it'd be truly happy and here we are. And what is this conversation specifically about spending your life together or was it just like. Let's go back and see what happens. That's a very good question given that it was going to change both of our lives. Now at that point i was pretty sure that she wants to spend the rest of my life I think you kind of have to be if you're gonna do something that dramatic right. Did i get on a knee and proposed or at that point without being in relationship. But did i say i'm willing to try to give this a real shot. If you are. Yeah that makes sense. I cannot wait to hear her side of town. This is such a great story. What just like very lot logistical question. That's pitted by by two before before this. You said that you are obviously friends with benefits in friendly. Like how often were you talking head in. Like how much more did that go to when you were brought During our time san francisco who is an off and on thing here there and there was some decent communication back and forth always very very good time there a lot of fun a lot of fun hanging out when she first met me. She wasn't in a space that she wanted to a relationship and vice versa but when abroad it was almost like much more debt to our conversations since you removed the physical aspect. Tirelessly sounds like quarantine. Wow okay all right well. I think that's all we need from jesse for for this part. Yeah i was super excited to hear from cassie. Now yeah me too me too. Let's get cassie on the picture here. Hi cathy where you eavesdropping. I can hear him. i like. I'm literally right next to him so nice to have you join us cascades now castle thirty two years old she also lives in colonel obviously with jesse and she is originally from the bay area also married to jesse by another secret husband around so cassie.
00:35:14 - 00:40:05
We are so curious to know. I've only seen jesse like his whole adventure and heard stories from his sisters point of view. But i'm so curious now from your point of view so tell us go through the whole thing like wendy's you guys were your first impressions of jesse why i mean so jesse and i met in san francisco in all honesty. I probably his dream girl. Because i think on the first day we met i was like i don't want anything serious like i just got out of a not great relationship. Which isn't typical for me. But i was just kind of at that point of like. I just wanna have fun and using like a cool guy and You know as time went on. I got more attached to him as women do right and You know. I think when. I wanted to be a little more serious after a while. I think he doesn't remember this. He says he fell asleep. Middle of the conversation of having a serious conversation in terms of like where we were going with this at some point it was like okay for my own sake. Let's let's move on and if we happen to be friends and talk that's great and if not you for my own sanity i think this is kind of. It's not going anywhere in terms of a serious relationship there. Yeah but what was different with him is that i don't know why just like couldn't really let him go. He was always kind of that one. Like i normally clean break. Don't talk to people you know. But for some reason with him it was like maybe because it was never so serious it never felt like we really needed to like a serious way so we would go off and on not talking or links period at a time. But we'd somehow always kinda come back to opening it up on some topic that you know. We both had jared interest in or pass a lot of like new york articles back and forth in certain things that we somehow kind of their way back into each other's conversation. I forgot to ask jesse on the first time. But how did you actually meet the very first time. One of his best friends was dating my best friend and they were going to meet at the park. One saturday washington square park on so we packed up. Our dogs in the wine at the boys at the park in jesse was the wing man and i was one of the wing women and we just gotta hit off ended up going to hanging out the whole night. Ic- jesse like a big sister perspective so my own opinions of what the old jesse was like. I love to hear how you would describe jesse before marriage before being in a relationship with roman going to think of the right where he was very independent. Very nice guy. He wanted everyone to have a good time but he also wanted to be having a good time and so he you know after party would be his pad and he'd you know always the very social kind of winning everyone to hang out but he was definitely Enjoying himself right uses successful guy at his own. Really nice bachelor pad in san francisco and i was just kind of all about jesse in all honesty. Which isn't a bad thing right. It's kind of normal especially at that age but Yeah that's how i would describe. Let's just take a quick break from jazz. Seeing kassy's amazing story and let's go into a couple of our sponsors. Here's a special message from our sponsor. Gobble do you remember at the beginning of the pandemic win. Everyone was like super pumped about cooking and sharing their food photos. Right remember that and like a million months later. No one's posing their food photos anymore because we're all so frigging sick of cooking. I know at least for me. I just need variety and my meals. And i can't -ccomplish that by just cooking my own. That is why gobble is the perfect meal delivery solution because you can whip up delicious and healthy meals in fifteen minutes or less gobbling. Listen army of sushi chefs that do the time consuming work for you and we just tried the me so glaze salmon and was divine. Everything comes with pre portioned fresh ingredients such as already chop veggies spice blends perfectly summer sauces. Just pick meals from gobbles extensive menu each week including a variety of flavors classic dishes global recipes and delicious vegetarian options plus a line of lean and clean recipes featuring low calorie and low carb. And by the way they also have breakfast and desserts. Yod that's right. See what a difference. Gobble will make for your household. They're offering our listeners. This fantastic limited time deal for six meals for thirty six dollars plus free shipping. That's dinner for two people for three nights all for just thirty six bucks. An offer only available through gobble dot com slash. Dateable get a special offer now by going to gobble dot com slash dat for six meals. Thirty six bucks okay. Before we get into that we just wanna think cloud paper for making this episode happen. Not all toilet. Paper is created equal cloud. Paper is made from bamboo which generates at least thirty percent less greenhouse gas emissions compared to treeline toilet paper but is comfy.
00:40:05 - 00:45:01
You ask okay maybe tmi but how is it's super soft also superstrong hello three ply and lint free instead of getting anxiety from sold out toilet paper you can get cloud paper delivered right to your door and never run out with subscription options to fit your needs. Your order will be shipped free of charge. Try it and cancel anytime. Cloud papers already low cost but if you use our code you get fifteen percent off your first order just go to cloud paper dot co and use the code dateable to get fifteen percent off. That's cloud paper dot co with a code dat e. to get fifteen percent off. It feels great. It's sustainable delivered to your door and less than a dollar roll with our code. See so that you started to get more feelings but like did you take it seriously at the beginning or is it more just like how women will sometimes get feelings from a friend benefit situation. I think i mean in the very beginning. It wouldn't know a difference right but overtime it was definitely different like again. I think if you ask any of my friends they would be like. It was always different working. It was something that i could never really let go in. Yeah i always knew that he was in you know. Maybe that's also why we stayed in contact goes like really close to Shared so much in common with. Maybe he didn't really see this series of it at the time. But i think looking back in kind of acknowledges that were there once once you guys have the conversation about. Not making the serious. What happened did you go onto date. Other people have other relationships. Yeah the first time we kind of like ended things that lasted a few months slightly. Tried to get into kind of the same situation so ended after that after that we were very platonic for years. The i on to date other people. You know the story kind of skipping to the end i guess. I know jessie penning talk a little bit about the article trip. We had planned a trip with friends. And i was dating someone in who had just moved into my house and was watching my dog while i was gone on the trip and ben kinda rocky with us leading up to the trip actually and my best friend and i are catching up over wind before the trap into is like what would happen. If jesse changed his mind and i was like never happen. I was like we have been platonic for years. We actually have a really good friendship right now. Like you're crazy absolutely crazy. But it was so funny. She kinda called it for the trip. Yeah because we've seen each other multiple times reveres spin flirty but play pontiac. You guys were talking pretty frequently. Yeah but in a really. I mean for me. It was a very friendship manner. I'm not sure what was kinda brewing in handling the trip. But so did you have that reaction to your best friend saying asking and i think from my own protection aspect right like i had truly kind of let go of him as in a relationship. Because i've never could see him wanting it he was enjoying his travels night even asked him before. I was like hurtling low. Li like i feel like people would be a little lowly news like new friends all the time and i'm constantly stimulated with new people and places and things to learn you know i think for my own sake i really really put that aside and was fine with it i really was okay with it. But when he pulled a fast one on me on the trip i was also like dumb. If i didn't us a try so i broke up with a guy who is living in my house. When we came home rewind for his sake. We gotta get to that moment that climax of a movie that we're watching right now that romcom where the rahm really comes out so you guys alleviated out. Let's take us to that movement. You had no idea. You did not expect this conversation to happen at all yet. You've had a deeper connection with jesse the whole time that he's been away you get on this trip to antarctica and take us to the moment of the conversation. What exactly went down. It was like christmas eve Basically kind of tricked me into like going outside away from the group in just started talking in laying it out like straight just cut into it and i was speechless like i think like when he proposed kinda blackout. So i'll i'll tell you what i remember. It was kind of like just caught me off guard that i don't know my memory of it's actually somewhat a little hazy I m. he told me. I was like a little hesitant in. You know in all honesty. I was worried that he didn't know what he wanted. More than like. That was my absolute worry of. I really risk all of this. Give it a shot. Even though i didn't think he had any ill-intentioned but does he really but it was worth it to me to take the risk for him. And so i think i told him i needed to get off the trip and go home and like the and my own house.
00:45:01 - 00:50:00
So little bit of a clear head we were cut off from communication basically there and it was like a surreal world. Right i was like. I wanna make sure that like this reality that you're talking about and you actually mean this but kind of gave him a commitment ish that i was gonna try to make it work before we went home. Sweet so you said you went home you obviously if the sky place you guys like living together in a serious relationship like what was happening there maybe a month month and a half before the trip and these had been a little rock earlier and i thought we're getting better and we had a pretty big argument. I think not that long before i left. I had some really bad trust using custody quickly. I like what steps on it. But you know i think stepping back like i wouldn't have gone home and broken up with him right then anyways right but i also when i stepped back like was he the one that i was going to marry. Probably not so. It's probably worth risk. Jesse could be right. Like i have that feeling that it worked out. Well it would be worth worth lowering the dice. Will you took a huge risk right there. How did that come station. Go which conversation when. I got home when you got home. And by the way he know anything about your history with jesse not really liked. Jesse was staying Jesse mentioned his birthday party. Jesse actually watched my dog the weekend after that. So like april of that year. The in article is december. He happened to be home. And so i had told my boyfriend at the time. I was dating this guy who i kind of used to date. Gonna stay at the house. When i'm not there and watched brooklyn so he knew that something was there any new his name probably knew that he popped up on text now and then but he had pretty he had been engaged before and had lied to me about seeing her and other skeletons so i was dislike not overly concerned because to me just a really wasn't a threat and was like i'm just not even going to bring it up given the issues that we've had on that topic so jesse knew about him. I assume you took a huge risk. But he did. He know that you guys were like kind of on the outs like. Did you share that. Think he really did know that in all honesty i. I've never asked him that. I don't think he knew but like some of his friends knew the guy. And i think we're like i. She'd be happier with new right so i think he did a little doubting for information as well too. So he's like nothing is getting way gorge regardless so. Go really terrible for the bystanders. Still a good guy do feel bad but ultimately this was what was meant to happen for me jesse so. I'm so glad that it did. I'm going to ask this question for julie. Not jesse's sister julie but are julie. She loves timelines. So you go home. You have this conversation with the axe while then boyfriend now ex and then what is the time line between that to him. Moving out to jesse moving in all of it. So i come home Airport with the dog drives to san francisco back to our house. I do it within a few hours being home. Because we're supposed to go to a new year's eve dinner party with my friends. I can't like fake it the whole night so yeah the next day basically any news pretty upset obviously a newton's stuff out and then jesse came back from his travels two weeks later i think in new straighten wow pretty vast and how did the relationship develop from there. Yes where he first moved in. I'm sure there was a moment of like. Oh my god this is real and then how did it change from Let's see this is really gonna work out to you feeling confident that this is. This is going to be a a solid relationship. I would say it take. It took probably a few months to really get the feel of it. I mean i had barely lived with anyone before. It was very long. And i knew he hadn't he also hadn't really been managerial so i had to a lot of deep seated worries about how it was gonna turn out across a lot of avenues. That honestly he just was perfect like straight from the beginning. We really don't fight. I mean even before covid. Since i quit my job travelling like i think we've been around each other twenty four seven for like closely a year and a half now And things are just easy. I don't know why we clicked very well. I told him before. We need to fight more. Because i don't want to make sure that we're both being very clear air expectations and being honest but and i had a dog at the time to and he'd never had a dog and he moved right in and was like perfect. She liked him more than me. Like it was really upsetting. Like he just moved straight in and it was like he was meant to be in the house. We're probably took a few months before. I was really comfortable but there are never really any red flags or signs. That had me worried. Besides just the notions. I had in my head of things that would be red flag. Once he became ready he was ready basically.
00:50:01 - 00:55:03
Yeah and see that that across guys right. I have other friends too. that it's like the guys are noncommittal to the point where their all and then it's just it's done and lightest on. It's the whole thing it's like light is on when you get in. Oh man fascinating well. Let's get back in here so then we can. We can have low conversation of both of you. We have jesse and cassie back. It's like your names are kinda right. The kind rhyme indiana doesn't it just fits well together. There is one question we haven't asked you. Jesse is did you know that. Cassie in her ex. Were on the rock snow. You know our conversations were i don. I wouldn't describe. Conversations is getting too deep until like personal relationships i would. I don't think i would ever ask her. Oh how's your dating life. You know it would be more like let's talk about what's happening in the news. Let's talk about this. Let's talk about that. You know is much more other stuff. I had no idea. We knew that she was dating. Somebody absolutely absolutely. But because i was ready to go in put all my cards on table. And whatever she said she said you know i was. I was willing to to risk it so it was probably a good good timing that she's not super fulfilled or happy in that relationship Otherwise it might have been a harder decision on her end. I mean ultimately though like like if you guys truly are the right people for each other like you know like you obviously would want to stand at her happiness. The way of her happiness if she was with someone else. That was the right person. So it's kind of like. I'm gonna put it out there and if it's meant to be then it's meant to be regardless one hundred percent and that's how the conversation went in antarctica where you know broader outside and it was just spilling my guts out and like you know i'm someone who is usually kept a lot of feelings in. I think she said at the time. How does it feel to be so vulnerable. 'cause but that's how it had to approach it right. It was like i didn't know how she felt. And if this is crazy to change to people's lives entirely right me not traveling. More her nonreligious anymore. But that's that's how i was gonna say you know sort of like a hail. Mary like this is how i'm feeling and let me know so. Luckily it worked out. And i don't remember this but jesse said i asked you want kids as my one. My one fire. And what's the answer. After she listened to everything. I said and we were making our way back into the vote. she didn't give me a yes or no yet. You know she was. Like i need to think about it smart woman and then right as i was open the door and she says you do want kids right. Hey you gotta get the out. This was not the time to just slowly get into the thing. This is very honest. Question for jesse right like he doesn't like to be tied down from all the facts that i knew. I didn't know if he wanted to do that or being. A relationship where we travel forever and don't ever settle down and have kids so that was kind of my. I need to confirm that we can be on the same page about this and the rest of it we can figure out i found it so fascinating that you guys were more just not like talking about deep stuff. It was more just like really getting to know each other as friends in. That's how it progressed. Like it is very. It's interesting to me that that's how it went down in our relationship or friendship started as cassie said. It was just sultana. Can here in there. We chat but then over time it grew and it grew to the point where she was someone i definitely wanted at my birthday. You know so. The friendship had grown and developed a from just two people that were staying in touch. I i gotta plot out this this. I don't i don't even know like kassy's time line or something like a vision board From the beginning of you meeting jesse and now to marriage your your relationship started with you. Saying i don't wanna be in a serious relationship. I just wanna have fun. Let's keep this casual to then now these conversations about doing life. Do you want kids. And i think that is so interesting. Is that you're both different people now from when you first met and i think that's partly why this works is that you've evolved so much throughout the years. I mean in some ways. I'm glad we didn't meet each other in college. We each other out as early on in our lives as we probably should have. And yeah i do think and you know even our interest grew in the same path and that gave us something that i think we really bonded over to. I mean you know the wind part will definitely be a part of our future together and was definitely a huge part of why we kept in touch. I used to look forward to. I remember one time. He sent me a package out work. And my all. My co workers knew that this guy would send me wine and this one said it was from morocco and it was a weird shape bag.
00:55:03 - 01:00:13
And so i was like ooh wines. I like open it up in front of workers and it was like really nice. Rug that like matched Match my room. I was so caught off guard. I hit it under the basket of like my best friend was like why would he send you that. The same one that kinda called it out later like why is he sending gifts. I was like. I don't like yeah. This was after my birthday. I was in morocco. Morocco is known for all their. You know handwoven missing that and you know. I don't know if there was like a gifford being my first Wine club person doing a. Thank you for housing all this wine or maybe it was just something that i was feeling inside and just you know. Wanted to send her something. Nice thinking avert kind of thing but yeah the the time line. that was after the the birthday I know it's seven or eight months after that we go on her trip. Wow but you know she says you know we're we're growing we're changing but we also realized during this time how much we have in common which i think is really great from a outdoorsy perspective. We love anything to do with hiking and snowboarding and jet skiing in snowmobiling and everything. I proposed to her on Everest base camp after a twelve day. Hike tell us about the proposal okay. Give us a time line i. How long had you been dating or living together until you propose. Uh so we had been living together for about a year was thinking about posing we had a bunch of trips lined up. You know and i was like oh. It'd be fun to do it. Entre make it special going to burgundy france In september that would have been nine after. I moved back but then i was like. Oh that might be a little soon. But at that point i was ready. I mean it was. There was no doubt in my mind that she was going to be the one and It ended up being a year after we went to nepal for the ever. Space camp hike. And so i hid this engagement ring In my in my luggage Through about four different airports and only is ten days of hiking and then at the very top eighteen thousand six hundred feet again. I ne- well. No wonder kathy says she blacked out probably because she was like elevations sickness like the cold. The elevation the surprise hit it very well. I honestly had zero percent clues coming. He had had my best friend. Lie and say that it'll start to look soon but it's not a babo boss. I really had no clue. I wanted to be a surprise. Yeah that's how he got engaged and then right after that. Well actually before that concede quit her job and we were supposed to be traveling. The world in twenty twenty ally. Jesse nomad here. We go around to as happened. It didn't work out that way and march covid hit. We had two great months in south africa And we came home Spent some time in Carmel great putting aside all the you know. We have a lot of the same interests in activities. It's also been of nice spending so much time together just hanging out at home and we ended up launching our own wind blog and website on where we write about wine regions around the world and we had a micro wedding on a vineyard. And sorta just yeah. It's beautiful and pasta house. a robot. see you guys. Both obviously had such different life experiences. Like coming into this like what do you think you both have learned like brought to this relationship from your respective pass. These spurs jesse's like send a lot of memes and wine. No i you know. I think for me. It's really a trusting of a gut instinct right. I think that's what it came down to for both of us is you can put all these things in your head of pros and cons and over. Think things in this. And that. But i think generally deep down you know when. Someone's someone that you could see yourself with and that. I don't think i know it never left me. Even though i had decided i was okay with not working out. that was still there And so for me you know. Just never never letting that go. Follow your instinct in your your got I i am so happy that i had that ma mindset to just say i'm not going to settle. I'm not gonna just fine. What's easy and safe. I'm gonna leave the the state's going to travel the world. Because then i really learned a ton about myself. You know you're alone a lot as cassie said earlier. You know you need to be independent. And i think having all those experiences really led me to realize how truly unique it is when you can connect with someone on so many different levels so many common interests whether you know then switching gears and talking about something very serious that has happened in the news having the same humor all those things in being aware to realize that i think was something that came from all those experiences and then when it was there was happening.
01:00:13 - 01:05:04
I knew i had to do something about it are also. I wouldn't forgive myself if i didn't have that conversation. I don't know if we would be together. You hadn't away in some ways. I'm really not sure we would learn a lot about yourself. And we're almost more comfortable with settle down because you taking your time and then it also pushed us not to have that kind of physical relationship. Were that easy like oh. Let's just go. Do this activity together. And then that's that the end. So i'm glad that you listen to your cell phone what you wanted to do needed to do. And that kind of brought you to knowing enough about yourself. Yeah i think that's a really good segue to takeaways from this amazing story that you've shared with us and i think ultimately like when you are ready you're ready and i think sometimes we want to jump ahead but we have like life outside of relationships to help us develop and grow as people in. That's when you become ready. I feel like we're all like condition to specific timelines of when we need to do things but ultimately all of us are kind of individuals in need to work on our own timelines and discover ourselves. I love what you said. Jesse about like ultimately like this was just like something i needed in my life like. I was ready to take whatever to have. Cassie in my life. And like there's all the stuff the all the experiences people can do in life but ultimately like the people in our lives really are like so unique. That's like the things you can't reproduce and my other takeaway is just like solid. Relationships are built on friendship. And i love just your whole path of friendship. And i can see just from talking to you all. Just how solid that friendship is. Even when it's now in the sense of antic relationship and marriage absolutely i feel like you two are the epitome of throwing out all the dating roles because you probably roque all the dating rules and all the dating books from all the dating experts. Believe them but we broke them. Which is it just shows that you break the rules to create your own rules. And that's why this relationship works. And jesse you says something that really i think to speaks volumes for your relationship as you said i was not ready for relationship as ready for relationship with cassie. It's about her. It's not just about. Oh all of a sudden i'm ready to commit. Let's fine whoever. It's about being with cassie and i think that's the important parts that i think love is rare. It is something that we all want and something we look for. But it's not something that you can just get once you're ready for whatever so when you do find it. I think a lotta times in dating. We are so scared to put ourselves out there to take a risk and just say let's sit back and see what happens. Let's just sitting out like let's let's see what happens. Let's see where life takes us but sometimes when you think a love or connection that's so rare it's worth putting yourself out there knowing that you're not tied to an outcome knowing that this could be the worst thing that could happen or the best thing that could happen to you but all it takes for you to step forward and put yourself out there so. I commend both of you doing that. At the other takeaway. I have from this entire conversation is i think we all have to do it. Our way and think. I don't want people to listen to this episode in the story. And and think oh. The guy went on a few days with doesn't want to commit to me. I'm just gonna way. Maybe he'll go to antarctica. And i'm just gonna wait. We can't create that false hope either exactly but ultimately we can't wait for people. We can't wait for things to happen but creating your own y- Making it your own making dating your own is the way to do it and not thinking that well this worked for other people well if it worked for other people doesn't mean that it's necessarily going to work for you end of the day. We got to follow our gut and follow. Your gut sometimes goes against what you've heard from other people too so kind of like crude carving out your own way of dating is really really important and i think just to add one thing that you a you were saying about like fuller thinking like oh i'm gonna get the guy that moved to antarctica like i think the biggest thing that cassie you just moved on with your life like you weren't thinking like oh i am messaging jesse the life. Try to get him back and like have this like whole concoction plan like set up. It was like only in those times when you can kind of be more organic. That's when things plowed. It's never when you're like sitting waiting for something to actually plan. I also. i'm not sure it really would have worked out well between us if We both but especially me had it moved on.
01:05:04 - 01:10:02
Because i think there would have been resentment and i you know i think we would have had to not talk at all and things just would have been more damaging we really both say. No you know we have our own independent lives in. It's better that we're not together but there somehow was always just something to keep us on that friendship level. That kind of brought us back together. We really both defiantly moved on with our lives. And i think that really ended up playing out well for us For anybody listening to this podcast right now. Who may be down about dating. Maybe they're thinking. Wow i've been in the dating scene for a long time. I'm really looking for a connection looking for love. I'm just now finding it. And i'm getting disappointed. Left and right. What is some advice you give to anybody which is a lot of people who feel really alone in this experience and who feel like they're ready to give up on finding love my advice would be. Don't dwell on it. Don't focus on it. It will come It'll come. it'll come for for you when you're least expecting it instead of being beating yourself up over at all i have met the right person and everything focus on something else. Make yourself More interesting finding new hobby. Go take up something that you've always wanted to do. Put your mind and energy in such better places. There's so many better things you can do with your time and then worry about you know oh woe is me and oh there's not enough good guys and everything you put yourself out there you start doing things that you actually wanna do you start loving yourself and start. Being independent will then. There's going to be a good outcome no matter what because if you love yourself and then that special someone never comes around then. Oh well you still love yourself. And it's great being independent and finding out who you are inside is is always a important first. Step there to the puzzle and maybe it could be a good advice for someone who's kind of struggling and maybe needs to take a step back on our. Let's say definitely put yourself out there. But yeah what he said. Don't focus on it I would personally redirect my energy towards relationships in general not necessarily a romantic relationship. I think you often mind partners through that and even if your eventual partner comes through other channels you'll need strong friendships to get you through it. So you know there are other relationships. I think that you can focus on and drive. A lot of energy into that are also really important in that. Time will come as often when you don't expect it But definitely agree with jesse. Put your put yourself in your other relationships first and things will come. I've ever like getting bad advice for fred like that was like i was looking thick of really going on tons of dates than being like. You're trying too hard just like it'll come when you least expect it. I remember like in the boat. I was like. Oh i got. This is the most annoying advice to here. But that i did do that. And that's what i did. Beat someone what. It was totally unexpected. I was just living life in. You know all that stuff. So i totally agree with you. It's just like one of those things like when you're the thick of it sometimes you're just like Like why we're always looking for a solution and sometimes it really is. What you just said is like. How do i build myself up to the person i want to be yet remained open for when someone does cross my path. That's the challenge right lovett. Well thank you so much. What is the name of your wind. Blog it's called. The wind scribes grabs dot com or on instagram and online And our ultimate dream is to start around small label so That you want to follow along. It is up every questions. Let us know i love always good to like find like one connection with seven share. Like every time you're at a watery jesse you're like oh i hit up cassie like it's an instant reminder like a sub-conscious dirt. Yeah definitely i wanna do one last exercise with youtube. Because i'm just so curious like what you would say to this. If you had to choose one word to describe your relationship. Don't say yet. Just think about it. Think about it. Give you like a second. And don't say don't tell each other and on the counter three. You're both gonna say that word at the same time. I'm just so curious what you would say so take a second. Let me know when you found your word to the very words. One word the word maschera probably thinking this thing where we had our vows and we both use the same quote from song our vows. Amazing i am one advantage same page adventure interesting. We just kind of the same thing. You're both of interest so you're on the same page an adventure to get here. You know life is funny in sometimes. It works sometimes. It doesn't i think it's a great story and on re sharing in podcast community so our story has changed multiple times right but each time.
01:10:02 - 01:12:53
We're always we're always instinct and we're always like ready to change it for each other but also kind of wanting the same things out of it and I think that's been a really cool adventure for us to to go through together and You help each other in good ways but know that we're always going to be supportive in kind of on the same page for what's coming next excited for future adventures. Thank you so much for sharing your story and for opening our eyes to how love can work and the many different ways that love can work in the different timelines. That people can be on. So i think this is going to be a really great episode for anybody who's just like. When is it going to be my high also for anybody listening. If you enjoy this episode please give us a rating apple podcasts. It really helps us deepen our relationship with you when you give us a good a five star review and it shows are love and your love for each other so that's where we can buy. Love is an apple podcast. I've got word just drink. Drink your wine. Leave us a review. It's all good jazz person. All right and intrude dateable fashion. We're going to wrap this up. Stay below the dateable. Podcast is part of the frolic podcast network five more. Podcast you'll love at frolic dot media slash podcasts. Want to continue the conversation. I follow us on instagram. Facebook and twitter with the handle at dateable. Podcast tag us in any post with the hashtag. Stay dateable and trust us. We look at all those posts over to our website. Dateable podcasts dot com. There you'll find all the episodes as well. As articles videos and our coaching service with vetted industry experts you can also find our premium y series where we dissect analyze an offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums roseau downloadable for free on spotify apple podcast. Google play overcast stitcher radio and other podcast platforms. Your feedback is valuable to us. So don't forget to leave a review and most importantly remember to stay dateable. Fifteen minutes could save you. Fifteen percent or more. is that shakespeare. It's geico i. Yeah that shakespeare from one of his unpublished works. Whitby be not for awakening and hey give it. The other batteries fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more no. It's from geico because they help. Save people money. I hate to break it to you but geico got it from shakespeare gyco fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percents or more.