In modern dating, we never give each other enough time....so we're setting up Jeff & Nora for a 24-hour date to see how their opinions of one another change throughout the course of the date.
In modern dating, we never give each other enough time....so we're setting up Jeff & Nora for a 24-hour date to see how their opinions of one another change throughout the course of the date. We discuss how you can even plan a date for a stranger that lasts this long, the ways your perception of the other person can change throughout the date, and what we can all learn from giving people a little more time when dating.
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S13E18: 24-Hour Date
00:00:01 - 00:05:00
The Dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that the Huffington post calls one of the top ten podcast about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about. From sex parties to sex droughts, date fails a diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host Yue Xu, former dating coach turned dating sociologists. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Krafchick as we explored this crazy dateable world.
Hey everyone, welcome to another episode of the dateable podcast. I'm your host UA, along with my co host and producer Julie. And here we are talking about modern dating again, surprise surprise. At the end of the year, everyone's trying to figure out their love lives. So everything we'll be talking about will be just so relevant to what's going on right now. Oh my God, I still can't get over that it's almost the end of the year. Where did this year? It flew by, I feel like. We say that every year. And I saw this great meme that was like, you don't see anybody saying 2022 is going to be my fucking year. Like everybody was saying about 2021. Like everyone's like being overly cautious, you know, let's just get through this year first. No one will ever jinx that again. Yeah, but I think for a dating perspective, this type of years always fascinated because we hear people all the time saying that the dating apps are dead. This time of year in December because everyone is just all over the place of holiday stuff. And then it's that first Sunday of January, the busiest time of the year. So I think people. What is it like the Super Bowl of data gaps, people have called it before? It's just get your dating apps loaded and ready to go, but we are doing something very interesting for today's episode. Because we know we've heard of so many of you say a few things. I think one is that people feel like there's never enough time on dating apps that people kind of make snap decisions, maybe they don't give people enough of a chance. You only get one shot, that first day, if it's not fireworks, then people are quick to move on to the next. So we hear that side. And then we also hear people that are sick of data apps that want more organic connections, more interesting meet cutes, more interesting dates, I guess, maybe as a third element of it, you know, not the traditional go to a bar or even a COVID date of a walker park. What are some ways that you know we can be more creative on our dates? So we're kind of combining everything into one for this massive data experiment that I feel like the two of us have wanted to do for years. We have got it to wonderful subjects to do a 24 hour date. Yes, you heard that right. 24 hours. These two brave souls volunteered to be part of this experiment, knowing that they will have to spend 24 hours with each other. Now, of course, the first question everyone asks is do they have to do an overnight? No, they do not. We're splitting up the days as day one and day two, okay? Get your mind out of the gutter. We're not forcing people to sleep together on the first date. But hey, you know, if things go well, maybe they'll do an overnight thing that's up to them. That is their decision and on their term. I feel like this experiment could not get better if they did that, but one of the participants, Jeff, he actually put up on social media. What would you do for 12 hour dates, the comments that he was getting? Were hilarious, 'cause people did even know his 24 hours. They just thought it was 12. And a lot of them were like, that's a long ass tie with someone you never met before. So 24 hours is a long date. That's for damn sure. It's going to be very fascinating. It's going to be interesting to see how people's perception shift throughout the 24 hours. I've never been on a 24 hour date by self, but if you like add up the time obviously that you're with people, I feel like I've definitely had dates that I like them way better at the beginning and then I stopped liking them and then vice. Vice versa that was more of the slope and that grew over time. So we really fascinated to see all this condensed into one weekend. The beauty of this experiment is that it is a blind date. They have not seen each other met each other. They don't know much about each other. And we've also matched them up for specific reasons. So it's going to be mind-blowing. I can guarantee you just to see the shift of what they thought they were getting themselves into, what they think they're typists and what they end up feeling. Of course, all of us have been there where, you know, we've been, I think a lot of us have been on these first dates that go on forever and ever. You come out of it and you're like, wow, that was an 8 hour date. I don't know why. And then you reflect back and you think I have no idea why we spend so much time together. I wonder if it's a forced long date, how that could change their perception of each other. Wait, you may have been on an 8 hour day before.
00:05:00 - 00:10:00
So many. What? So many. I've never. When and where did it go? A few times, damn. Damn girl. Yes. Well, you saw the date like maybe in the mid afternoon and then you say, let's go get drinks. Let's get brunch or whatever. And then like, hey, what else you got going on today? We want to go to the park, you want to go to the museum. Then after that, it's like, oh, you're hungry. You want to get dinner. You want to get drinks after that. And then it goes on forever. I've been on these dates 'cause I really enjoy someone's company, not that I thought they were my soul mate and I had nothing else better to do. For them is the truth of the true reason. And I wanted to open myself up to that kind of experience. I've been on a few of these marathon dates, and then in hindsight, you can't judge the quality of date based on the time you spend with someone. We've talked about this before because it's so dependent on whether you have shit to do that day or not, whether you are in the mood for something like that, but I have been on these marathon dates and it is very telling because how you feel about them in the beginning completely changes by the end. Wait, so the marathon dates you've been on have they been within the first couple dates first dates ever? Yeah, first date. Wow. What happened after did you? Did any of the progressive to anything? Or were you like I did it all at 24 hours? Yeah, slept with them. You know? That goes into the hours. That adds a 15 minutes into the 8 hours. But then you have to cuddle and do the morning after thing, you know, it's just all ads adds up into it. I've also had dates where I've slept with them. I had to go get brunch with friends. And then I go back and wow them. Yeah. Not for you, huh? I really haven't done that. I feel like the only people I've done long dates like that. It's when I'm already established with them. It's never been someone very early on. Yeah. No, I've done a few of these first dates like that. And to answer your question, no, none of them turned out to be relationships. But I would also argue those were self contagious relationships in those 8 hours. We dated for 24 whole hours. Yeah. Started out beautifully and then I learned so much more about him and I decided it was not for me. I mean, you know, if we're gonna talk about efficiency, maybe everyone should be doing 24 hour dates. We're gonna sit find out if it is a good idea or a bad idea from this episode, this experiment. But I think another interesting dynamic of this experiment is that we have given both of them only a $100 to use throughout the day. And per day. In San Francisco, the most expensive city in the U.S., but I think part of it is people sometimes equate good dates with what you do, not the quality time that's being spent on it. So of course, some of this will be interesting to see how they stretch their buddy. They've definitely been asking, can we go over slightly? Which is actually a testament to how much money people spend on dating. It's kind of crazy when you think about it that a $100 doesn't really take you that far. I mean, granted, it's 12 hours that you're doing stuff, but it is kind of an interesting perspective that that scene as you know, not a lot of money. I feel like back in the day when I was a teenager, a $100 felt like what the lottery, you know? Yeah, I was just thinking about the same thing because when I lived in New York with my ex-boyfriend, we were in our early 20s and make much money and this is New York City. We gave ourselves a budget of a $100 a weekend. Wow. A weekend. For both of us and we lived off of that for two or three years and we learn how to manage with groceries, how to make things for each other, how to be more resourceful. It is doable, even in a city like New York City. So I think sometimes we forget money, buys convenience, it may not buy effort. Yeah, that's a good point. I think it's fascinating though because if you go out for a nice dinner in San Francisco, there is a $100 right there. Yeah, exactly. It's like done, exactly. So I'm very fascinated to hear how they decide to spend their time. And I think it's really kind of a nice thing that we're doing the alternating days because there is something nice about. It's almost like you're giving a gift to the other person by planning out the date. And I love we are so damn progressive UA that we have the woman going first. Yes. Why should it wear dates be like this? I love it because there's no judgment because we've set the rules for them. I'm so excited to hear the outcome and the post date wrap up of this experiment, but I've been telling this experiment to a few of my friends and coworkers as well and so many people are now open to it. In the beginning, when we first posted this, so many people were like, hell, no. I would never do this. I would watch someone do this. I would never participate. And now the more we talk about it and because of the holidays, I think.
00:10:01 - 00:15:02
Some people have said to me, if you do this again, let me know. I'm down. I'm down. So maybe this will be a rolling thing. I will say we did put out a call out on Instagram, the podcast and Facebook. We got a ton of submissions, so there's definitely a group that was eager to do it. I would say they were about 90% women. So women are way more into this than bed for whatever reason. Great women. Straight women. Call out. And I've asked a few of my guy friends if they would do it. And the answer was all no. So, of course, that's a generalization, but it is what we were seeing for whatever weird reason that women were maybe a little more receptive to this idea. So hats off to Jeff or being brave enough for this experiment. He did not need any convincing. He was like, hell yeah, I'm gonna do it. And you'll see why. His personality is just so in line with this experiment. It just makes so much sense. Yes. Yes. Before we get into this episode, I want to give a few shout outs because I realized that so many people listen to the podcast and then we talk about it on DMs or through email or even through an in person conversations and we forget that we had these conversations. So I want to give a shout out to my friend Venus, who's a goddess. Through and through, and she's been listening to our podcast and Julie, I don't know if you have friends who are like, I keep hearing you talk about a podcast you do. And I finally got a chance to listen to it. It just shows that not all of our friends actually listen to our podcast, but this is like, I finally listened to it. I'm hooked on it. I listened to it on my commute. You guys are so funny and so engaging and I enjoyed every episode. So I want to give a reverse shout out to Venus. Thank you so much for listening to our show. And for being entertained by us, because we entertain ourselves, too. I love that name. Definitely goddess. You know, it's interesting because we have so many interactions with people on a weekly basis that sometimes if they happen early at the week I forget by the time it's the intro. Because every week feels it's weird. I feel like time goes really slow and really fast at the same time. Things that happen, day ago, somehow, I feel like is a month ago, even though it was a day ago. It's a time warp. Yes. Before we get into our question, I want to ask you your opinion on one thing that's came up for me earlier. Oh, holiday related. And it kind of made me think about it when you were talking about our Friends listening to the podcast 'cause I may offend people, so hopefully people so if you're a friend of Julie, you can just turn off the podcast now. Maybe hopefully they're not listening to this episode. Now, all good, but I wanted to get your take on Christmas cards or maybe the more PC way down is holiday cards. What are your thoughts feelings? Yeah, people might holiday cards sent him in the mail, they typically not a generalize. They typically are photos of people's family for the most part. Are the ones I get. What are your thoughts? Yeah, it's funny. My partner and I were just having this discussion or better yet a debate about this? First and foremost, I'll say this. I will love anything anybody sends me in the mail. I love getting physical mail, unless if it's glitter. Now do confetti or glitter that is just bad, juju. Don't send that shit. But physical cards I love because they're handwritten, or there's something personalized about them. Now, how do I feel about sending them? My partner and I took some holiday photos, I don't know what we're going to do with them. He wants to send out physical cards. I want to send out PDFs. So there's a difference there. And I said, fine, if you want to do physical cards, you can send it out to your friends, but for my friends, it's an email honey, okay? 'cause I know what I do with the physical cards when I get them. I admire them for a few hours, and then I'm sorry, babies. I recycle them. They go in the trash. Where else am I going to put them? So I hit this whole conversation with my partner about a two dot to send them out, which is field leads on them because I've had since I moved. I've had a lot of friends reaching out, asking for my address to send me their cards, right? And I do want to echo the sentiment that I always like to be thought of and it's always nice to receive something. But you know, she's about to drop the bomb. Oh my God. I had a total grid first. I really appreciate it. I also would not be offended if I got dropped from the bay list. So how do you say that to someone, though? 'cause I do the exact same thing. I have this stack of ones that pile up that I look at for a second. Oh, cute. And then I put it in the recycling bin, because I can't even put them on anywhere or I just won't get rid of them at that point. It almost feels wasteful to me. And what I don't like about them is a couple of things. I think part of it is I'm Jewish. So I was never raised with sending Christmas cards.
00:15:02 - 00:20:06
For holiday cards, you don't do Hanukkah cards. No. So it's not like a thing that's I understand that people have traditions that all these years. I don't have that. So if you drop me from your list, I will not be offended anyway. I think the other piece of it is I feel like it's another thing that kind of like alienates single people. What single send holiday cards. Yes. Exactly, and why? Because the only people that send holiday cards are families or maybe what I have seen creep in and this is probably what you're doing I would guess is a couple with their two dogs, their big shift family. Is that what you're doing? Yes, we're doing a makeshift make shit family, I just said. You heard it right. Family. Yes, we have our two dogs. It's really adorable, but I'm a little embarrassed to send them out, 'cause I'm like, we have nothing. There's no news other than what's up. We survived COVID. I have nothing else to update people on. Well, okay, so but here's the thing that I don't like about them. They're very generic. If you really want to spread holiday chair, why don't you text and see how I'm doing? Not just set in a generic card. So there's one thing I almost feel like it elicits the same stuff for people as social media when they're seeing things that maybe they don't have. I personally don't fall in that camp so I'm just guessing that it elicits things for people. I think for me, it's like I just feel like we should celebrate milestones that aren't relationships. I feel like why can't people be as excited for someone landing their dream job or something? I feel like there's a lot of other milestones, but no one would ever send out that holiday card. I just want single people to send out a photo of their data app of them getting blackout drunk at a bar or maybe even on a walk of shame, you know? Like, that would be a good holiday card. But that would never happen, or they would get ridiculed for it. So what I don't like about them is that it's again, it's some, you know, you must fall into the societal flow kind of, right? It's like once you've hit this stage of family, that's when you send out your Christmas cards. I never got Christmas cards from half these people until this. 'cause that's when you have something to celebrate is when you have a family. And that's not the right way to think about it. And I had this exact same thought when I was in my early 30s. So one year for Christmas, I did send out a single UA Christmas holiday card. Love it. I listed out all of my accomplishments, meaning like surviving blackout drunk drunkenness, still surviving singlehood, being in my shoebox apartment in New York City. Good for you. It was meant as a joke, but also inspired by a sex and city episode where Carrie has celebration of her singlehood and she had a registry. So I did that. I sent it out as a picture of me in a Santa hat. I was like, have you holidays, just me? And so many of my friends, my single friends all kept it 'cause they thought it was hilarious. And then some of my coupled off Friends were felt bad for me. And so they were like, is everything okay? They called me up. Everything's okay. You know, just want to check in on you. But I agree with your views in that there's always something worth celebrating and it doesn't mean that you have to be in a family or in a relationship to celebrate that. Yeah. But also what I don't like about these cards is that it's all about me, me, me, me, me. Here's what's been going on in my life. And I'm gonna send this out to people that I haven't even spoken to in a year or two. I get these all the time for people like I haven't talked to you since last Christmas. And it was the same exact thing. It was just really updating me on your life. What if there was a way? Here's an idea for you all. You send out Christmas holiday, sorry, holiday cards to your closest friends from friends who matter to you. And you write a memory that you cherish about you and this friend together. That card, I would save and I would collect them for years to come, because that means something to me. And so I think that's what we're missing here is a holiday spirit is about celebrating the connectedness that we have, not just you, your life, and your accomplishments. That's a 100%. And you know, I definitely, I'm not trying to say this in a way that people shouldn't celebrate marriage to children and the traditional things that our society views as accomplishments. I absolutely think that we should, but I think we should be more open to other accomplishments too. Those shouldn't be the only ones that are celebrated. So I want to call that out. I definitely like seeing people's kids. I just wish it was socially acceptable that people without kids or without partners could also sense something. It wouldn't be like a weird, oh my God, what's wrong is everything okay, type of situation. Julie, we should send out our we should send out cards. The two of us are lesbians. In fact, someone just asked me yesterday. He thought I was a lesbian with, of course, Julie, and I was like, well, you're not the first. So why don't we send out Christmas cards or holiday cards, celebrating all of our fucking dateable accomplishments? Because we did so damn much this year, I'm so proud of us.
00:20:07 - 00:25:00
Exactly. I love that idea. Why don't we just, you know, put our partners out there too and call it a, what's a quadruple that a triumph anymore? No, no, no. A quad there were not part of this. They were not part of these accomplishments, okay? You know which pictures I'm referring to. Julian, I have very, very good engagement photos at two of us. That would be perfect. We do. Before we get into our question, have you watched sex of the city reboot yet? I have not. You told me about it last night. Too tired to watch it. I know the spoiler already, and I don't want to spoil it for other people. I don't know what happens at the end. And it's a tie to the title of the show is and just like that. Right? Isn't that the title? I can't even. I'm still shook up about it today. I do not like it at all. And I wanted to discuss it with you. But I agree will give our listeners another week to catch up and maybe I'll make it up the insurance next week. You know, you probably read all the spoilers because it's gotten a lot of press. And I think they did that for a reason, but I agree. I think it's a really weird way to start off this show. Okay, question. We'll get to something less weird. Here's the question. Yes. I know that you're supposed to give people more of a chance than just a first date. But how many dates should you give someone before deciding if you want to keep seeing them or not? Yes. And this is in line with the 24 hour experiment a bit. Yes. Gonna come back here, right? We've had guests who do 5 minute dates, and then they'll actually leave after they don't feel like there's chemistry. We've had guests who do like the one day only and they go on like a 1001st dates. There is something to be said about giving people time because naturally how we met people before dating apps were through repetitive FaceTime. When you see someone over and over again, you develop chemistry with them. So yes, beyond a first date, I think after the first day, you should always ask yourself, did I enjoy spending time with this person? Take the romance out of it. Did I enjoy spending time with them? If the answer is yes, go on a second date. We believe in a two date default we've talked about this before, just because the first date is all about just getting to know each other in the second date you can gauge more of that chemistry. Now coming out of the second date, I think you should come out with, and from zero to a hundred. How attracted am I to this person? So that I want to see them again. Zero to a hundred. Am I past the 50% mark? And if you are, go on a third date. And I think that's how you keep progressing every day you gauge where you are on that spectrum. I think some of this is knowing yourself too, because there are some people in our audience and our listeners that give people so many tries and they don't really know what they're looking for at all. And then there's the other people that swing to the opposite side of the pendulum that are quick to get rid of people, right? So I think some of it is knowing where you are too. There is something nice about being like, I know what I'm looking for to some degree and I'm not saying that it should be qualities like they're 6 feet or whatever. But you know, like someone that makes me laugh. If I can't laugh on a date, then maybe that isn't the person for me. Or maybe not even someone that makes me laugh at someone I can laugh with like enjoy myself. So it's good to have something that are hardened non negotiables. I think that is important because if you don't have a north star, it's gonna be really hard to find anyone. That being said, if it's all superficial, non negotiables, that's another reason why maybe giving that second date or extended time could actually help you get out of your own way. So I think there's a side of understanding yourself and where you are. The other piece is every date's a spectrum too. You may not feel fireworks, but I think there's been dates I've been on that I wanted to get out. Yes. If you feel that need that you just do not want to be there and there's zero attraction. I think that it's okay to trust your gut a little too. I think sometimes we try to make things work that just won't work and that's not necessarily right approach either, but I think if you're at least 50% on this person or you're having a good enough time that you're enjoying yourself, maybe you're not like this is my husband or wife, but at least you're saying I'm enjoying my time with this person. I think those ones can grow. But I think if you're in this stage that you're just trying to like because they're good on paper, for instance, make it work, even though you hate being there. I think that is okay to listen to yourself and just not keep giving a try. Okay, I think that's a good way to wrap that up then. So quick announcements for this week at dateable podcast, follow us on Instagram. Remember 5 star reviews really, really helps us out. So that can be our holiday gift to us.
00:25:01 - 00:30:01
No need to send us a Christmas card. Just give us a 5 star review we'll be super happy. I think that's good for announcements and let's take a quick message from our sponsors. This episode is made possible by our sponsor better help. In our years of doing this podcast, there has been one major takeaway and that is therapy is beneficial for pretty much everyone. And we are so happy that better help makes therapy more accessible for all by matching you with your own licensed professional therapist. You can start communicating in under 48 hours by connecting in a safe and private online environment. And you can send a message to your counselor anytime I know I do. And schedule weekly video or phone Sessions. Better help is more affordable than traditional offline counseling and financial aid is available. As our wonderful dateable listeners, we want you all to start living a happier life today. As a listener, you'll get 10% off your first month by visiting our sponsor at better help dot com slash dateable. Join over 1 million people who have taken charge of their mental health. Again, that's better help spelled HELP dot com slash DA, TEA, BLE. This episode is brought to you by pros, most of you have probably heard me talk about pros, the world's most personalized hair care, and I want to update you all on the incredible results I've been seeing since using my customized products, which include a personalized shampoo, conditioner, and appreci mask. My hair is now noticeably smoother. And I used to have really frizzy hair and now it's much easier to tame. I personally really love the pre shampoo mask because while it smells incredible and it just makes my hair feel even softer. To get started with the personalization process, you take an in depth hair quiz with questions around where you live, your diet and your lifestyle. And they even take into account stress. By analyzing over 85 personal factors prose determines a unique blend of ingredients to treat your exact concerns. Prose is a healthy haired regimen with your name all over it. Take your free in depth hair consultation and get 15% off your first order today, go to prose dot com slash dateable that's PRO SE dot com slash D ATE ABL E for your free in depth hair consultation and 15% off. Okay, let's hear how this 24 hour date unravels. Let's meet our daters. First up, we've got Jeff. He's 43 years old, he lives in Oakland, originally from the suburbs of Chicago. And he's pretty single. He's been taking a dating sabbatical while until now. He recently moved back to the bay from Chicago after ending a pretty serious relationship. Mind you, I have not gone on a date for probably over two years. So instead of me thinking like, oh well, you know, let me just ease on into it. I'm like 24 hours. Let's do this. Now we've got Nora, she's 35 years old if she lives in San Francisco originally from New York, and she's single and actively going on dates. She recently moved to San Francisco after being bi coastal since college. Dating in New York as not the great. Like the ratio of women straight women to straight men is just like so skewed. So for me, I was excited to come to the Bay Area. You know, I just got here and dating's been for me a really positive experience here so far. Everyone has been so intentional. They're open to communicating what they want. I mean, I haven't met someone who I feel like chemistry with yet, but I think men know they have to work a little harder because there aren't millions of women just like who are beautiful and gorgeous and running around New York and there's stiletto heels that are like 5 ten. It's like nice to see men doing the work. So this 24 hour date concept. We sent Jeff and Nora out for two 12 hour dates. 10 a.m. to 10 p.m. on Saturday and Sunday. And both daters got a $100 to spend. And we had Dora plan day number one, Jeff planned day number two. And throughout the day, you and I checked in with them to hear how it was going. What they were up to, how the connection was blossoming. Basically what they were spending their time doing. So let's hear from them for the first check in all about their first impressions. It's been really good. You know, it's like, we haven't run out of things to say. She's just so dope and smart and like the dynamic and fascinating. And yeah, I'm just having a really interesting time like finding out about her life. We walked across the entire Golden Gate Bridge, and we walked all the way through in pursuit and we just had dim sum and a $100 is not a lot of money, but we got dim sum for like $20. So I feel like it's a win. I think we've learned a ton about each other. It'll be fascinating, it could all go downhill from here. We are in my attract into her. I don't know, I feel like we're more like friendly with her than I'm like attracted to her. But that might change. I don't know. First impressions are great so far.
00:30:02 - 00:35:04
Jeff seems really open. He seems down for anything. He's such a good sport. He's also just really open and vulnerable and that's really cool. And it's been really nice to explore the city together. So overall, great for suppression, great selection. Thank you for being thoughtful in that choice. Yeah, this is really fun so far. And then we checked in with them again around 6 p.m. to hear one surprising thing they've learned about each other. Now keep in mind this is 8 hours into the date. So this is way longer than your typical date. Let's just hear what they found surprising. What have we been up to since what did I check in? Like, three, two, three. So now we're in the mission district. We're at mission Chinese food classic place. We love it because it's super cheap. We only have $32 left and we're trying to maximize it. What have we done in the meantime? We tried to find the best mojito. Could not find it as like we kept going to places that did not have mojitos. We had a lot of bad drinks. So we went to like three or four different bars. We got tired because we been walking like I think we have like 30,000 steps today because we did walk across the Golden Gate Bridge, walk back and then walk across the entire presidio all the way to dim sum in the morning. I don't know if I mentioned that, but that's what we did. As for the question, what is something that I surprising that I learned about her? I don't know that she's like a badass and she's dope at her work and also she's still trying to figure things out like the rest of us, right? Like we're talking both about like going through like impostor syndrome and struggling with that and we're recovering people pleasers and how do you figure out a way in which to be, you know, happy and successful. So a lot of conversation about that. Hello. We have been in search of the perfect mojito in SF since our last check in. That was kind of an abysmal failure, but in a really fun way. Apparently there's a mixed shortage in San Francisco. So yeah, we just kind of ended up bar hopping and now we're at mission Chinese. It's one of my favorite places. Yeah, one really surprising thing I learned was just how much Jeff stepped up to help take care of his nephew. He moved all the way back to Chicago, got an apartment. I thought that was really incredible, and it shows, you know, how much he comes through for the people who cares about. So very surprising. Actually, I have two, so I'll tell you another one. His last date was two years ago. I was like, mine was earlier this week. Sorry, but I mean not sorry 'cause I literally don't know you. Well, I do now, but 12 hours ago I did not. So yeah, it's been really fun and I will check in with you probably another few hours. And then at the end of the day, around ten 30, we checked in with them for final time. We still could engage if there was a romantic connection here. So we really wanted to push them a little further and ask on a scale of one to ten. How would they rate the date? And did they see a romantic connection? This is getting spicy. Ten 55 p.m. lane in bed back and Oakland. Man, like I hurt my leg, like I said, we walk so much. My body was not ready to be walking that much. But anyway, to answer your question, how excited I am about tomorrow? I don't know, man. We just spent 12 hours together, like a 6, maybe a 7. Maybe after I get some rest, maybe we'll be higher. As for whether we're compatible together, I'd probably rate it like our compatibility is like a 5 out of ten. We had really amazing day, right? And we connected and I give that like 7 and a half 8 out of ten because just we really get along. But the reality is is like I'm a play guy plays like rooted in who I am and I asked her like when was the last time she played and she doesn't know, right? So it's not wrong or right. It's just different. You know, we have different like my lowest level of play is probably over and overwhelming amount of play. So we'll see tomorrow. Maybe I maybe I'm wrong about that, but yeah. We could talk all day about anything, especially about politics and race and all the all that jazz, but from a compatibility standpoint. Right now, it's like a 5 out of ten. Maybe it'll change. Hello. Sorry I didn't do the memo last night. I was so tired. I literally put a heating pad on my hip and fell asleep. I would say I'm excited. I'm like at a 7. And that's only because, honestly, 12 hours is a really, really long time. You know, it's like this paradoxical situation where I think you're giving someone obviously more of a chance in time to get to know people and it's been awesome to be able to delve more deeply and to kind of, I think you're trying to wear us down, right? That's the point. You're also trying to make sure you give each of us give someone a real chance because I think in this disposable app era.
00:35:05 - 00:40:04
It's just like people don't even try. Yeah, it's like 12 hours, so I'm only giving them a 7 because of that. And I think trust intimacy that comes with time and you can't cram that all at once, right? It's like sustained connection. It's consistent behavior. In some ways, yesterday was this, for me, I tend to overshare and then have like an emotional hangover. You give me two hours I'll do that. So if you give me 12 hours I'll really do that. So maybe also feeling a little bit like, oh, okay, what will today bring given that yesterday kind of brought, you know, definitely new and unique experiences, both in terms of experiencing SF generally, but then also, yeah, experience all these things with a man. I literally didn't know 24 hours ago. So yeah, a little bit actually more nervous now that he's had a chance to kind of see who I am, right? But yeah, I'm also just physically tired I'm old, not old obviously bit. Heating pad after 12 mile Walking Dead. Yeah, I do think maybe there's a romantic connection, but I couldn't say that after seeing someone once, you know, that's just, for me, little impossible. And then we're back at it again for day number two at the daters met again at 10 a.m.. This time, we checked in with them around the same time as yesterday, which is 2 p.m., but we didn't get a voice memo back until 5 p.m.. So WTF, what was happening? Turns out they were having a little too much fun. Okay, here is my recording, probably two or three hours late apologize, but you know, these things happen. It's been awesome. It's been so lovely. The things that I planned out worked out even better than I thought. So I took her to my friend reims restaurant. She owns this really dope, awesome restaurant, and she was there and a bunch of my friends that also worked there were there, and they told us all about the restaurant. They gave us a tour of the restaurant, and that was really the thing because I wanted to do something different where we interacted with other people. And it wasn't just like pressure was just on us to like, oh, we can only talk to each other. So that was the strategy. Like, okay, let's do things that I wouldn't even normally do anyway. So I'm going to reams, they gave us so much extra food, which is great because I was like, our budget is only like $30. And then we went to my Friends campaign holiday party. So my friend mad haney is running for office. Some assembly district or something like that. So we crashed his party because it's a free party where they had like grits and shake it and wings and waffles and stuff like that. And then we got drinks and then we started telling everyone about this dateable podcast episode and then people started buying us drinks. I had a plan of what we were going to do next. I was actually going to take us to the mall and pass out flowers for people that we thought were really dope. But this guy just came up to us and he goes, hey, you know, y'all really cool. I've already bought your shots. You want to go to this party at Twitter. I might be going to the store department. So I don't know if he's going to actually go. We'll see if he comes through, but we're down. Oh, the other thing of like, are we more attractive to each other or less? I think we're, in my opinion, I think I'm less likely. I now know her enough to know that I'm super playful, super flexible, super, and she's just different. And I'm much more like clear about that as we've spent more and more time. And also like now she's asking less questions, so it's like not as curious. So like that's just the vibe and the interesting. But still, we're having a really fun time, so. And that was the goal. Hello. Sorry for the delay. This is Laura. The date's going really well. You're asking me to check in again about the romantic CrossFit car. And I feel like it's an interesting concept. I think in two hours, I was like, okay, this is somebody I would go on another date with, right? But the activation energy for that next step in terms of the romantic viability, like, I don't think even if you spent like a full Troy for hours together, you could figure that out. It's sustained, consistency. It's sustained like reliability that. For me, and I know that's like maybe too much, right? Like, how do you define romantic? For me, it's like, oh, do I feel safe around you, you know? Yeah, I don't know, it's going really well. It's been wonderful. We're also it's not even about like Jeff to some extent. It's like how incredible San Francisco is. It's how wonderful people have been in response. We're like, we have a hundred bucks to do this thing that we get three drinks, we get free food. It's like pretty incredible, and it's like, I think just generally, it's been wonderful to be reminded that if you're open, the universe is open and kind and that's pretty fucking cool. So yeah, going well. I could maybe see something. I don't know, it's just like you can't tell in 24 hours. But what an experiment, this is pretty fuzzy cool, so thanks. And then at the end of the date, we did one final check in. We heard a lot about what was going down on the state, but not a lot about the connection still. So we really pressed if there was the connection and if there would be a date number two.
00:40:06 - 00:45:10
All right, final recording ten, 16 p.m. it has been a journey. We have done so much for 24 hours. The fact that just being with someone for 12 hours then a break and then 12 more hours is it's hard, man. It is difficult. Going back to the question of would we go out again? In my opinion, no. And not because she's dope. She's dynamic. She's beautiful. She's amazing. She's fucking so smart and it's gonna be so successful. It's gonna do so many dope ass things, but like combat ability wise. We're just different. We're just told her that. I was just like, you know, I'm like a play guy. I spend more of my time being much more process oriented and not focused on results. And her life is built around results like that's what's her whole life has been, you know, from when she was going to elementary school so now as a lawyer and all of the accomplishments had. So yeah, we're just different. We're just different. And much more curious. Or I don't know if I'm much more curious, but it's just like, I ask more questions. I don't think I don't know if she even asked questions a second to have. But she was definitely more comfortable and didn't feel like she had to prove herself or do any extra things that she had to do the first day. She communicated to me so we were much more real today and being much more real today, I realized that we were just not as compatible. Which is fine, right? You know, it's just what it is. But the fact that we were able to connect and be as sociable with each other for that long period of time, even though we didn't know each other was really like amazing and difficult to do, but we were able to pull it off. So overall the date was like a 7 and a half, 8 out of ten combat wise or probably like a 5 or a 6. And I hope she finds someone super dope and I would be down to crash her wedding. Hello, reporting back after the end of the second date. It was an incredible adventure. The first 12 hours, you know, I planned and so it was difficult to assess like what does Jeff like are his choices in terms of the things that bring him joy and how he would like to spend his time. He was really good with the flow. He was really down to do anything. And so there's an initial, okay, this guy. He's really flexible, he's really open, he's got a lot of wonderful positive energy, he's easy to be around, but you know, through the second date, because he planned it, I'm able to get more of a glimpse into how he operates and how he engages with the world. And so I think by the second half of this second date, it kind of became clear on a very fundamental level that we really like engage with the world differently and I think we view the world pretty differently. Again, I think the first 12 hours gave me a much greater sense of how our values and our morals definitely I feel like in a lot of ways aligned. You know, which I don't think you get that after a regular normal time first date, but you know, through the second date I think we were able to go even more deeply into how do we see things? How do we see people? How do we want to engage? And I would say, Jeff looks to play a lot and, you know, I've just learned a lot from him and over the last 48 hours and I definitely aspire to be more playful and to not take myself and others and life even too seriously, but at this point in time I would say we are fundamentally very different in that respect and I think, especially given that play is so important to Jeff and I'm just not as playful that you know I don't think romantically we would work out. We'd be viable, but he's definitely somebody I would love to be friends with and somebody I would love to continue to learn from and hang out with and yeah, I mean, he has really cool Friends. He's doing really cool things. You know, I think he's learned a lot about the importance of not expecting too much and just kind of living your life based on the values you have and who you are and being unapologetic about it. So I thought that was definitely really cool. And yeah, this experience was really fun. I learned a lot about myself and kind of how I do engage with the world currently at this point in time, as well as how I want to show up. So that was really cool. So yeah, I don't think we're gonna go out again, but I had a really wonderful time meeting him and I thought this experiment was very, very cool. So after this 24 hour day, we wanted to check in with both Jeff and Nora to hear what really went down and how they're feeling after it all settled in.
00:45:10 - 00:50:02
Let's start the conversation with Nora. So Nora, you went on a 24 hour date, which we're guessing it's probably the first time you've ever done anything like that. What in particular about this date was different than your normal date? Honestly, first and foremost, it was just like physically exhausting. I'm 35 years old. I'm in reasonably good shape. I thought, but after the first night, I literally had to put a heating pad on my head. And I was like, am I 35 or my son? Because this is like insane. But I mean, I think just like physically, it was like taxing in that respect, but I think also like, I mean, I had to commit to spending 24 hours with someone that I might not even like. And I think in this era of complete, I don't know, I feel like with the apps, people view other people sometimes, it's totally disposable, and people won't even give people 24 minutes. And here I am like, committing a full day to someone I don't know. And so a full weekend. Yeah, I was like, I have a lot of shit to do, but I'm definitely gonna just not do anything that I need to do in my life and commit to this. But yeah, I think we just were able to delve really deeply into our values our morals and I got a sense of who someone was at their fundamental level really quickly so that was definitely a really different. I feel like and I think I said this in one of my recordings. I was like, you guys just wore us down, right? Like that was like one of the things you did. And so at one point, I remember my vision of the date was definitely really different than Jeff's. I did a lot more like one on one thing. And I did like traditional date things. And he kind of my view is he kind of had like a scavenger hunt vibe to his stuff. And like, you know, I think generally, I'm a people pleaser, and I think I would have got along with some of the things he wanted, but he planned a second date and 17 hours in. He asked, we went to the Salvation army and we had to pick out things. Number one, I picked up very utilitarian things, which I don't think he like, yeah. We'll talk about compatibility later, but you know, and then he takes me to a political fundraiser. And I'm like, I'm taking this shit off. I am not going into this place. I literally looked like I looked homeless. I was wearing multiple layers of things. I just did it. I was like, by 17 hours and I definitely felt more comfortable, but I also had this paradoxical feeling of discomfort because I tend to overshare. I said this also. So like, in two hours, I can easily overshare in a date, but now you've given me 24 hours. And so I can really overshare. And so there was this sense of intimacy because of the shared time, but at the end of the day, I still don't know this person. You can't show someone 24 hours later, right? So you okay, so it's interesting. It sounded like at the beginning. It sounded like there was maybe more of a connection for you. And then as time went on, it seemed to be more this might not be the best match or not super compatible. Kind of walk us through that. What changed for you? Yeah, I mean, I think so I think physically I just didn't get to be completely Frank. I didn't feel a lot of chemistry initially, but I really, really enjoyed just personality. I thought he radiated this positive energy that I would love to be around. And his morals and values really aligned with the ones I currently have and the ones I aspire to have. I think he's somebody really committed to play in all aspects of his life, and I'm somebody who I tend to be a rule follower. I tend to take myself and things too seriously. I tend to have a lot of expectations about things. And it was like wonderful to be around somebody who was unapologetically himself and who wants to play, but I'm just, you know, I don't want to be more playful and I think I'm going to work on it for sure. I think through this experience I learned a lot about myself, but I'm just not that down to play all the time. I have stuff to do. I tend to take things really seriously. And yeah, so I think for me and complete honesty, I think I got the sense from him that I wasn't compatible for him and so for me, I think I was like, okay, I might have gone out another day with him honestly, but I think he'd play so important to him and I'm just not as playful of a person in that sense. I do think I'm playful, but I'm not gonna talk to strangers for 24 hours, right? Like I think yeah, I was like, my conception of the date was to get to know this person. And throughout the adventure, he engaged with a lot of other people. Yeah. And there was a lot of that, which didn't feel, to me, I was like, that's not what this is about. But I do want somebody who generally is obviously really social and we wanted to ask you about that because we also had that same feeling of there's a lot of people out the state all of a sudden. How did you feel about that versus one on one? Yeah, so you know at the end of the day when you have 24 hours, we did speak to each other a lot and we did.
00:50:02 - 00:55:03
He did ask me really thoughtful questions about myself and he was a very attentive listener. But I definitely felt like the spirit of the date was it in line with what I viewed the date to be and I was a little bit thrown off by that and a little bit like you know I think at certain point we stopped getting to know each other as well. And I could have obviously steered the date back and I think I did it. I was also physically really tired. And just to clarify, when you say that is shifted the spirit of the day, it went from getting to know each other to now it's all kind of activity based things. Yeah, it was like activity base. I felt like I was being challenged and I definitely want to be challenged, but not by someone I don't know, maybe completely. I am complete honesty. But he needs to figure out if I'm someone he wants to be with too. And I get the sense he wants somebody who's totally down to do all these different things to think outside the box and yeah, that's just not really like me. I think I need a little bit more comfort around someone before you know and I'm just not gonna show up to political fundraiser wearing a Salvation army special. I am sorry. Fair enough. Does that make me feel like I was like last night, you know, like we were kind of talking, and I was like, I just kind of felt like, oh, am I not that fun? That's my own stuff, right? Someone's own perception of me. You know, especially someone like, yeah, we spent 20 hours together, but he doesn't know who I am, right? And so this is a thing that I just need to work on. Not be swayed. Like, I know who I am, or I'm working on that. And I know I'm a fun person. And my sense of fun might not be the same as someone else's, but yeah, I think I do think we are not compatible, but I think I was a little hurt that maybe he didn't think we were bad. Because everyone wants to be liked anyway, right? Again, that's a meat thing. Did he say that to you? Yeah, I think so. I think he wanted to be direct and Frank, which I also really appreciated. I wasn't sure how I was feeling to be completely honest. I felt really exhausted and I feel like I didn't have time to really process everything. I think I would have taken more time to think through, okay, 'cause I do think it's really hard to come by someone who has a joy for life like that and morals and values that I just felt like he understood me. There was an implicit understanding there that I think comes a lot from our shared upbringings like you have Filipino. I'm Indian and a lot of who I am and how I perceive the world and a lot of the expectations I place on myself come from that Asian upbringing. And it's nice to not have to explain that a nice for somebody to get that. But I mean, there are so many measures of compatibility. And I mean, I think there was definitely other things that were lacking. It was just really nice to meet someone though who like, I feel like understood me and agreed with me on really fundamental things, right? I think he'd be a good dude. Like, I think you'd be like, for example, and this is not like this is not a line with the Asian purple. He was just like a really thoughtful person and like the second day he brought a care package at a rain. And he remembered like popcorn was a snack I really liked. And he had an umbrella and a poncho and popcorn I was like, that's so thoughtful. Here's a man who's like, yeah, he's like clearly emotionally available. It's ready to put the work in, right? Whether or not I liked or agreed with his ideas for the date, he came in with a really, really thought out plan. And you know, he introduced me to people in his life. And he did all the things. I think a lot of us want someone to do. And so I think I was kind of hoping the chemistry would be because he has a lot of the things I'm looking for. You really does. There was like, if I think fundamentally, we just kind of view the world a little bit differently and I think we're looking for people. I think I need someone a little lower energy and I think he needs someone higher energy. I thought I had a lot of energy, but I don't have 24 hour date every day energy. So, okay, let's hold that thought for a quick message. This episode is brought to you by drizzly, fun fact number one, it's gifting season. Fact number two, no one returns alcohol. In fact number three, I love gifts in hint. And so for this year, get everyone on your list and I hope I'm on someone's list. The gift of beer wine and spirits delivered right to their doorstep with drizzle in under 60 minutes. It's no wonder drizzle is the number one app for alcohol delivery. 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00:55:04 - 01:00:03
Have you recently decided you want to make some changes to your love life? Maybe you've recently reentered the dating scene, maybe you've gone on too many dates that went nowhere, or maybe you're just ready to take your current relationship to the next level. That is exactly why we created the sounding board, a true extension of our podcast that delivers a personalized experience, which includes monthly office hours where you can drop in and chat with us about anything. Weekly sound offs with guided discussions and regular virtual happy hours, allow Julie and I to become your dating sherpas to provide real-time guidance and wisdom in a more intimate way so we can all navigate dating and relationships together. Join the sounding board today by going to dateable podcast dot com slash sounding board. Again, that's dateable podcast dot com slash sounding board. What is being playful mean to you? I think it means being down and flexible, but I also think there are boundaries and there are limitations, just like there with anything, right? Like I think I think it was a really cool idea to go pick out something at the Salvation army, but then when I'm going to go to this political fundraiser, I want to be respectful to the candidate. I want to be respectful to the people around us. And I want to be presentable because I want people to respect me and I want people to I just I'm a rule follower to some extent. I think he had some other ideas. We're like one of the ideas was to basically pretend we're in a fight with an Uber driver there. And I'm like, I don't want to put an Uber driver in a really uncomfortable spot, honestly. That's just that me. So I think I'm playful, but I also want to be really respectful of other people and I tend to be really, and maybe I'm too empathetic. I am a really empathetic person and I maybe I'm attributing my own comfort levels and my own morality onto these random people. I feel like generally people don't care, he got compliments on his sparkly scarf. He got compliments on his hat on top of his hat. But I was just like, yeah, I just, yeah, I think being playful means being open being flexible of not being so wedded to results, but you know, trying things and experimenting, but for me to be able to do that, I think I need more comfort with the situation and we're coming with the person I'm with. It does sound like you would consider yourself playful. You're just not to the level of playfulness that he wanted. Agree. Or his definition of playful. That might not be the only definition either, right? Right. I actually think I'm a really playful person, and I believe other people would say that about me, but I can be shy. I can be a bunch of people, I guess, sometimes they don't believe, but yeah, I think for me, I don't think I embody any value or personality trait that's completely unbounded. And I think with Jeff, I saw a level of energy. I saw a level of playfulness. I saw a level of just kind of like not giving a fuck to be honest, which is cool, but I have not seen that in a lot of people that I typically surround myself with. And so I definitely feel inspired by him to kind of move a little bit further on that spectrum, but I'm pretty comfortable where I'm at, I guess. I'm glad I'm processing this with you guys. 'cause I definitely, you know, I felt like, oh, and I know this is silly, but I also did sense like, okay, I don't know for that compatible in these respects. But then when I felt like he was pretty direct, I was like, oh, but you don't like me, even though I might not like you, like, you know, it's just a silly thing that I think a lot. No one likes to be rejected or viewed as somehow less than, you know? Yeah. I mean, I think that's definitely that comes up with modernity. It's interesting because you guys kind of got like a bitty relationship within 24 hours. Yeah. That's also crazy, right? You know, and I was seeing someone before, obviously, before Jeff and you know, I feel like in one day I learn more about Jeff, than this other guy. I mean, and one of the reasons I am no longer seeing that other guy, obviously is because he just was not open or able to be vulnerable. And, you know, it's like really kind of crazy though. I would never have any expectations after a regular first date to get the amount of information I got about Jeff and to be like, okay, this is how we view family. And this is the unconditional love that we provide. The people that we care about. And this is how we show up and how we show that we're committed to the people we care about. And then after the second date, I really saw how he fundamentally interacts with the world in a way that I don't think you get that unless you're dating somebody pretty regularly for like weeks or months, right? It's also like we're doing all these different activities that bring out, I think, with an intensity that you wouldn't get during doing normal activities. I just don't think I would have seen that. Had we not done this together. But there was a shift on day two where you said you stopped talking to each other. Can you pinpoint exactly when that happened or what caused that to happen? Yeah, I mean, I think it was basically we went to this political fundraiser. There were obviously a lot of other people there. And then, you know, so we both had the same idea that we were going to have the beginning of the day, be really structured. And for me, I was like, because I didn't know him at all, right? And I didn't know what he'd like.
01:00:03 - 01:05:01
So I figured I would just have a lot of options available. But the first part would be pretty structured. It'd be pretty like standard and benign, right? Like a walk across the bridge. You know, we're gonna go through the presidio because it's beautiful. We're gonna get some dim sum because I have a hundred bucks and gives this delicious. But then afterwards, I wanted to be flexible. I wanted to do like a wellness check. Make sure he was feeling okay and then see what he liked and then we could adjust from there. And I think his view was the same. You know, he had a set plan for part of the date and then he wanted to kind of be flexible and see how they took us. But once we were at that bar, you know, and I'm not putting it on him. I don't know what happened. But you know, throughout the journey, too, we met a lot of really wonderful people. And you know, once I shared what was going on, especially in particular, there was this bartender crystal, who like, she was just wonderful, and she was like, wait, you're all on a date and you're less than a hundred bucks. And she just gave a string. She gave a shot. And that was wonderful, and that kind of thing felt organic, and it was still a part of the experience we're having together. But at some point, we're like talking to all these other people. The fundraiser and then we're hanging out with them. And I was down for that, right? But when I was looking back at the date, I was like, this isn't to me getting to know you. I'm not getting what we were supposed to get out of this date, but also again like I am somebody who is more focused on the goals. I am somebody who's like, you know, I was given an assignment from you guys, basically, and I'm gonna follow the assignment. And I think he just lives his life with more flexibility, which I think is a really cool thing. But I just, yeah, I felt like at a certain point we just kind of were just doing activities, but also like by that point like it's the second day, the weather isn't great. You know, we're kind of confined by certain things, like we're physically exhausted, you know, it's raining outside. And so I feel like at that point, it kind of became like, okay, we don't really engage in directly with each other. But maybe we needed the break too. Like I kind of had made jokes about napping or going to a movie where we just didn't have to talk to each other because it's like it was a good thing, right? Like there were so many like it was just so much time together and also like you're spending a lot of time talking to each other, but then you're also doing these physically arduous things. And I feel like I sound like I'm really out of shape. I'm not. But I'm like, I was tired. And maybe he felt the same way. I didn't think at the moment, anything of it, but then kind of looking back, I was like, wait, we didn't kind of stop engaging directly. And then we brought he brought it back like we ended up going to a comedy show and like other things like that, but I did feel like there was this moment where things kind of got like beard and that respect. You know, we got a vibe that you seem very open minded throughout the whole process. And I think that's a really wonderful thing. And I think you should, I don't think anyone should make you feel like not fun enough. I think that's all really dependent and maybe it just wasn't the right fit in general for both parties. But it seemed like you were very open minded, which I think is a good quality, especially on a 24 hour day to have, you know, that's really important as you bring what you've learned from this date into other dates. I guess, from your perspective, what is it that you learned from this experiment about yourself and how you're looking to date? Well, I think I've continually learning to just kind of, you know, be unapologetically me, because even throughout this process, I'm telling you that I don't think we're compatible because someone may not think he's compatible with me instead of really being introspective. What do I want? What am I looking for? Because I did sense I think I was like, I tend to do this thing where I want something to work, so I try to make it work. Like we weren't that compatible, but I really wanted it to work because he has seemed like a really great guy. I've learned that I have to continue to try to just be introspective and think about what I want and not be so concerned with other people's perceptions of me and what's going on. I definitely learned that. You know, I don't think I'm gonna ever be as enamored with play as Jeff is, but I it's a really good idea to be a more playful and to go into things not having any expectations. I felt stressed out about the date initially, right? Here I have to plan 12 hours. I don't know anything about this person. He could hate everything I suggested. He could not be able to do the things I want to want to do them, but he was really down and really chill. And I worried a lot about nothing ultimately. Obviously, for both willing to do a 24 hour date with a person. We don't know. We both have to be somewhat open. Well, I think that's a good amount from this first one. We'll have Jeff come on. And then we'll have you stand by for some takeaways. Jeff, you've done a lot of fun experimental dates we're guessing that you've never done a 24 hour date before. So what about this date was different than your average date? So many different things. The fact that it was 24 hours, the fact that we spend 12 hours back to back, the fact that it felt like it was ten dates and also that it was a blind date where neither of us knew anyone.
01:05:01 - 01:10:01
We were just like, this is the first time we were connecting. And that also we only could spend a $100, which then made it really. We had to be very creative in what we did in those 12 hours with only a $100. So it seemed like from the very start, you didn't feel like the romantic connection. At least from your check in. Was there ever a time that you felt this could be something or was it kind of consistently more of a platonic vibe? I mean, maybe early on, maybe in the first four to 6 hours when we're just trying to get to know each other. Because again, you get to learn so much about the person that a lot of times you don't even know if you're like, do I like this person or not because you're like, man, we have so much time together so we're gonna have plenty of time to figure this out, right? And then I think at one point when we were talking about play and I'm a play person. That's what I do. That's what I do for a living, all that. And she was like, I don't play a lot. I just don't play. That's just not my thing, that it was like, oh, okay, that's one of the first times where I was like, oh, well, this is where we are different. But also I was repeating myself, you know, even in the recordings like, you know, you know, I'm embracing my panda like spirit. Like let me be curious and let me be present and let's just keep going because maybe that will change or maybe that will evolve. But I don't think then it ever went there. So as soon as she told you that she wasn't into play, that's when the connection ended for you? No, I think it was just like, okay, well, you know, that doesn't mean that it's not possible. Let's just continue to experience this day. But just the way in which we each show up is drastically different, right? She's awesome, right? She's like dynamic and like at the top of her game. I think also because she's so results oriented. It's very different from me who are much more process oriented. So just even the way in which we show up in public is different. And I could see that in each and every one of our interactions when we would go to like a certain bar or we go to like a restaurant or something like that would just showed up differently, which then just felt like it was just not that type of connection. Having said that, we were both really curious about each other, so we I'm fascinated by her. So we talked the entire time. So I want to dig into this process oriented versus results oriented a little more. Sure. Can you kind of elaborate? What does that mean in terms of how you view it compatibility? So, you know, because I play, that's like what I do. I love to not really focus on an outcome. I'm really more in there for like attunement and connection. I talk a lot about this about how one of your first forms of ways in which you connect is via attunement. When a baby looks at a mother's eyes, like their brainwaves are identical. That's the way in which people begin to play, right? So everyone is always trying to attune with each other. So when I'm in a space and connect with people, I try to create like a psychologically safe space. And then we kind of like go on an adventure together. So an example of that yesterday was, you know, it was like, okay, well, guess what? For my day, we're going to one of the things we're going to do is we're going to dress up and then we're going to go to this like random event. I'm not going to tell you the bread and it's going to be a surprise event. But we're going to go to the Salvation army. We only can spend like $6 and 50 cents each on an item or items, get dressed up like I bought like this ridiculous hat and like a shawl and stuff like that and I was like, all right, we're gonna have fun. We're gonna try this thing to see what happens. So I bought stuff with the idea of like, oh, this is gonna be entertaining. And then she got like a sweater or something like very utilitarian, right? Which is just her way in which to show up to play. It's not wrong. It's just different. So then when we were going to the event, it wasn't. We weren't going in with the same play oriented energy, and we were on the same page, if that makes sense. I'm struggling a little bit with this. Simply because to me, I feel like everyone has a different definition of what play is. But I feel like by her being along for the ride in, that's evidence of being her of her being playful. And I'm also putting myself in that situation. I would probably been even shyer than that. Sure. I mean, for her to even agree to this experiment that already means that she's pretty playful and experimental. And so I'm curious to hear from you, Jeff, at what level of play are you expecting from the women that you date? Oh, I mean, I don't know. I think, no, I think I do know. I want to be able to go on a date with someone or have an adventure with someone where we both are willing to put ourselves out there and be fully present in the moment. And that the result isn't as important as the process and our ability to have an experience together.
01:10:02 - 01:15:11
And I think at times and again, the way in which I'm trying to describe this is like, it's not wrong or right, right? It's just different. Like the way in which we just were showing up in each space was just different. You know, when we went to my friend Matt haney's like holiday party for his campaign because he's running for office. And just the way we interacted with people was just different. And again, that's not wrong. It's just that we just weren't on the same page. It just didn't feel like we were connected. So, you know, I feel like, you know, we're looking at this, oh, what did she do wrong or what did I do wrong? I don't think we did anything wrong. I think we were just we interact with people in a different way. And then we even agreed and talked about it that way. They were just different people. So I don't know if that answers your question. No, I think that makes a lot of sense. Like, every day, is it going to end up being the person that you end up being with, right? That's just the matter of fact of this. I think the 24 hour if anything just probably sped up, understanding each other and seeing each other. I guess the part, though, that is interesting to me is there a world where differences could actually make you compatible and they're also are a lot of different other elements that make someone compatible outside of just play and how they interact in social settings. I guess was there anything that you really liked about her that you do want in a partner? Yeah, she is ridiculously smart, ridiculously dynamic. We had so many interesting conversations about politics about power classism, all this stuff. So that's, I mean, it was really interesting and riveting and fascinating. And she's just doing a lot of really dope work. You know, speaking to know about that, I could have talked to her for we did. We talked for hours about that. And I love that. I thought that was really amazing. It just also are the way in which we both want to impact the world. We both want to like our work is revolves around leaving not a legacy, but leaving an impact that actually helps other people. And to speak for people that may not be able to speak for themselves. So that's where we both connected. You did communicate the incompatibility. Can you walk us through how you communicated that? Oh, so then after the day, when we were just like texting back and forth, you know, it was like, hey, you know, this is what I really loved about, you know, our interaction, everything together. But I feel like because I'm much more of like a play guy and I kind of show up in this like play setting and a much more silly and very out there that might not be your vibe. So, you know, from my perspective, I didn't feel like we had that level of compatibility, but I still feel as if you're super dope. And so you did mention that her curiosity tapered off on day two. Did this happen after this talk? Oh, do we didn't have that talk until at the after all the way at the end of day two? Okay. So when did you notice the curiosity kind of tapering off? I think probably the second day, I think when we also became more comfortable with each other. We also have to remember that dynamic is we just spent 12 hours together and talk the entire time together. So in many ways, we felt like we had learned a ton about each other already. And then I think, I mean, my day, I felt was a little bit different from her, you know, her day. Mine started off by, you know, like I got her like a care package because she really liked popcorn and I found that out and I got like an umbrella and like a poncho and I was like, okay, let's start off today that way. You know, then we went to my friend's reams restaurant who the first time she was opening it up to anybody since the pandemic. So it was like a really special moment to like, oh, we got to go to my friend Reeves restaurant where the only people in there, only the people allowed in there at the time. And she gave us a tour and we talked to my friend Tim. And it was just like a really special fun experience and then going from that Matt haney's holiday party. I was constantly trying to create opportunities where not only was there like we had feel pressure that we had to entertain each other, but that we could actually show up in spaces and connect with other people as well as connect with each other. So that's how I felt like it was different and I put a lot of effort and time to figure out how to maximize the time and also create a safe space where we felt like we could connect to each other while also connecting with others. So I mean, it sounds like there's some areas that you did find there are two be compatibility, but this play piece is really what overshadowed everything, like enough to say that it wasn't worth going on a second date. What was it about that aspect that overshadowed all the other potential parts of connection? Well, I think it comes down to values, right? And one of my most important values is plays showing up in a playful, curious present type way. I think she interacts with the world in just a different way, that is also really interesting and fascinating, but just not the way I show up. So yeah, me understanding that is what being one of my core values is just like, well, this is how I show up every single day. So I already know that this is going to be something that would probably rub her the wrong way because there would be a lot of times when I would be silly and ridiculous and she'd be like, that's just not how I show up in the world.
01:15:11 - 01:20:01
And I don't want to put her. I wouldn't want to put her in a situation like that. How important is someone to show up exactly how you would like for them to show up versus someone who's open to working towards more playfulness or showing up in the way that you are expecting? Yeah. I think it's more of the openness, right? It's more like, you know, when I even when I describe it, it sounds as if it's like this is very rigid like there's only a certain way. That is what it sounds like. That is what it sounds like. And I'm sorry, it does sound that way, because when I even describe play, I describe it in like it's a very open ended like we're having like an adventure together. So there's a lot of opportunity to show up in many different ways and play and they don't have to play my way, but I just want them to be able to be more themselves and be willing to allow their silly weirdness to come out. And some people just don't find that. That's not their jam. So that's understandable. A lot of the people that I have dated are kind of weird and kind of silly and are open to things like I have these flowers here. One of the things we were potentially going to do is people watch and if we saw anyone that we thought was like really interesting or fascinating, we had these flowers. All right, I was thinking about giving them out to people. Well, I asked her, is that some Nora? Is that something that you open to and she's like, no. I know. Like, no, that's my thing. Okay, cool, you know? So then we didn't do that. I constantly was trying to, especially on day two, figure out ways in which how do we do something that's playful and fun, but also within her comfort zone. And if it wasn't, then we were just like, okay, we're not going to do that, you know? So 24 hours, you probably saw different sides of her throughout it. And it sounds like you kind of got a chance to explore different activities from what I'm gathering. What is it about the 24 hour date? What did you learn from doing this about yourself about what you're looking for about the whole experience? I learned that 24 hours is a really long time. I learned that what am I looking for that attunement is actually really important and that I myself have to also be more open to different people that might show up, you know, in a way that might not be like me. So throughout it, I constantly was trying to think, okay, you know, how can I make this more of a safe space so that we feel more connected? So I was constantly trying to be much more aware of that. And also knowing that it's also really scary for a woman to be with what this one guy like a taller dude for like 24 hours, so all this constantly also thinking about from a safety standpoint of what can we do where she also always feels in a safe setting to do stuff as for what else did I learn about myself? I learned that I could just roll with it. I mean, I was really proud of both of us, the fact that we were able to keep conversation going all the time like the second day we went on all these random adventures because we bumped into people that bought us drinks or took us here, took us there and it felt like we were traveling together. And I thought we, together had collaborated really well to be like, oh, yeah, we were doing this really cool thing. And people would be like, hey, we wouldn't want to be part of the adventure. You know, want to go here and we'd be like, sure, let's do that. So, you know, that was fun. I think that was fascinating that at the beginning of the day I had no idea where we would end up when we ended up in a drastically different place. Okay. Now we're going to bring everyone together for some final takeaways. Jeff and Nora in one room together. So we have Jeff Andorra back in the studio together and I would say UA and I've been on the edge of our seat this entire weekend. It's like we've been watching reality TV live. And this has been quite the experience. I wasn't even on the date, but I've learned so much about being on a 24 hour date and what that means. Before we go into our takeaways, we'd love to hear from Nora and Jeff about what will you take into your dating life from the 24 hour date? Sure. I think I probably mentioned this before, but to just be open and to not come into things with so many expectations. I think once I was able to not feel so stressed out about the structure of everything, things kind of flowed. And yeah, to take every experience as an opportunity to learn something about myself and the world around me. Yeah, just generally having more positive outlook about dating. It's not as awful as I'm taking some time. Yeah, it looks like you guys had a damn fun time if nothing else. Yeah, we did a lot of we did a lot of really cool stuff.
01:20:01 - 01:25:08
And you know, as I mentioned before, it wasn't even just about Jeff like, you know, for both of us were rediscovering San Francisco and we met so many cool people along the way. And it just got renewed my faith both in straight men generally, but also just people. If you're open, people are generally open and kind back to you. Well, I think also in regards to the openness, I learned also that Nora and I bonded over the fact that we were like, we are doing this. We are committed to doing this and we're going to get this together. And I think the more we spent more and more time together, we actually like together created these fascinating places where then people wanted to jump into our world. The first day was interesting in the sense that it was much more she and I, but the second day, all of a sudden, because we had a certain level of comfortability, other people really wanted to buy a strength, take us to their place, take us this adventure. How do I feel like we got on the same page in that way? And we were like, oh, we're like a team now. You know, and we're gonna make this like a memorable experience, not just for us, but for anyone else that interacts with us. I love that. And then I guess a question for both of you is what is one thing you would do differently when it comes to dating after this experiment? Okay, I'll go. I think I definitely need to be even more open. I mean, again, this is the first time I've dated anyone in like two years. So I had no idea what I'm doing here. So this is like a jump off the defense. So just I think I need to not just be more open, but be more willing to take risks that the person that might show up that might be compatible with me might not show up in the way in which I envision and that I need not limit that or have too many preconceived notions and really be like a panda, right? Playful curious and present and open to the adventure. I love that. I would definitely echo that. I think for me also, I've learned, I really want to be more unapologetically me. And the things I'm looking for aren't unreasonable, they're not too much. I'm not too much. And I think what was so nice about being around Jeff was like, how open and vulnerable he was and how willing he was to make a real effort. A lot of us are taught, we have to be like the cool chill lady and then like kind of lure these men in. It's like, no, if someone, if a guy is like serious about you, you're gonna know it and you're gonna know it by hopefully their words, but really you're gonna know it by their actions. And I felt like Jeffrey demonstrated he was committed to doing this in a way that I also felt committed. And so I'm just gonna try to like, if something's not really working and if I'm not getting what I need from something to not give it a million chances because there are people like Jeff out there who will do a line with me in a lot of ways. So something is going to be out there who's going to give me what I need in the time frame that I don't need it. That is the best thing you could learn from something like that. I mean, I think there's been so many interesting tidbits that have come up from this. I think we can kind of go into some of our takeaways from this whole date. But I think for me, the biggest one is that we always say that people need more time and modern dating. But 24 hours might be a little too much time. That's one thing that came out is it almost was hard for you guys to process how you were even feeling in the moment because it was just all about what you're doing on the states. And I think that almost there was too much pressure to do activities. And what I've learned too from the state specifically is that people view dating very differently. Some people are all about just, you know, we could go nowhere and have a connection. And then others want the experience and the activity. And I think you guys kind of got a little of each in the state. It's interesting to me to hear what people kind of reflect back on the date a bit more and Jeff, I think you're very in the experience. I'd say 90% of what you reported back was the experience. And I think maybe that is an area where Nora, you could learn from Nora of being more like, it's less about the experience and more about the one on one time and all the other people here. And then I think Nora, you probably learned the experience side you can learn a lot from Jeff of how do I be more in the moment? How do I stay curious? How do I stay present? So I think there's probably areas that both of you can kind of take away to kind of get that to be more well rounded. And it's ultimately a combination of both at the end of the day. If we just are looking for an activity partner, that's not really the core relationship, that's just an activity partner, but also if we're not doing anything interesting, then that's boring too. Yeah, I'll just say, yeah, I definitely wanna be more present person, I think I'm so goals oriented and when I think about what I'm looking for, I want a relationship, but why do I want a relationship? It's because I want marriage and kids, but obviously I need to experience life with somebody every day, right? Like, you know, life is literally millions of 24 hour sessions back to back. So do I enjoy hanging around this person, can I really be wholly myself and totally vulnerable and feel safe and comfortable around this person? So yeah, I definitely want to be more like Jeff in certain respects, but I still got my eye on the prize.
01:25:08 - 01:30:00
I'm gonna husband. I'm gonna do things where like, you know, I wanna get to know you, right? Yeah. Yeah, oh no, I completely agree with that. I almost feel as if the first day was much more of us connecting on a level of understanding each other and who each other were and then I think the second day was much more experienced lead. So we probably spent less time connecting in that way. So yes, I agree. I think one of the biggest takeaways is going into a date with a default parameter. I think we go into day thinking, I'm going to give this person a like 5 minutes and if they don't live up to what I'm looking for, I'm out or the connection's not there, but what if you said the default is I'm giving this four hours minimally so that you kind of know that you are spending your time with someone for a set amount of time versus them trying to earn extra time with you. That's just never a good way to think about it. There is something to be said about the yes and mentality. And I actually think both Nora and Jeff can learn from this. We talked about Nora, you know, we touched upon that that you can be a little bit more present and open to this playfulness, that Jeff has been talking about. But for Jeff, it's this kind of the same thing. There is a yes and mentality in play, too. So if Nora wasn't so down for Hannah roses or fighting in front of the Uber driver, maybe there's an ant to that and not just a series of putting her through tests. And I know for Jeff's point of view, these were experiential activities, but from Nora's perspective, they felt like Tess and she wasn't passing these tests. So you're creating this me versus you mentality. But if you had a yes and a mentality, then it's okay, she's not down for that, but let's try something else. And let's just show a little bit more compassion with that. What is interesting is, yes, both of you had, I guess, a more chilled out date, the first day, and then more activities based. It sounds like there was more connection on the first day because you were able to speak and talk to each other and ask each other all the questions, but on day two, both of your interests tapered because of the activities that were overshadowing the date itself. It just felt like there was a lot of anxiety around activity. What to do next? Well, what crazy thing can we do next? What crazy thing can we throw into the mix? And that completely overpowers the integrity of the date, which is getting to know each other. When we listen back to the check ins, your first day check ins are so different from your second day check ins because there was just a lot more intimacy and connection on that first day. Yes, I agree with that. I agree, there is something about when it is too activity focused. You may lack the ability to get to know each other. I do also have to say, though, you know, because you know, I'm all about the yes and like mentality and I feel as if and let me know if I didn't do this that if I presented a play experiment, if we didn't want to do it, then it would be like, oh, that's cool. We'll just do something else, you know. I wanted to create that safe space that it didn't feel as if she was going through like a marathon or Alan of now the next thing. But I do feel there's also opportunities in the play where one learns about each other that you can't learn from just talking about something, you know, it's more in the actual experience as well. So I feel there's value in both. When two people are in a space connecting with many different people and watching how they work with each other, they learn a lot about each other and that process as well. Because you can also say like, hey, I'm this way, but when you're in the experience, then people can actually see it as well. I definitely agree with all of that. And I didn't directly communicate when I felt at times some anxiety around things. And I do feel like if I had directly said, I don't I just don't want to do that. You would have been totally flexible and open. I think you always did communicate that you want to be to feel comfortable and enjoy what was happening. So I do think you do embody the yes and sentiment and I do think that you did exhibit that with me, but I do think we did lose connectivity because the other people ended up being very distracted. But I do think you do see things about the way others engage with the world. That's really important to know when you're looking for long-term via abilities at them. Well, you guys just went through like a month long relationship at one weekend. I know, was that couples counseling? I know, I'm like so tired. Love it. Well, thank you both for participating in this. This has been such a great experiment. And we're so glad that you too. Have a good time and learn so much about how you can show up for dating in the future. Yeah, and taught us how to get free food and drinks. Yeah. Now we know. It's going to a bar and say, we're doing this dating experiment.
01:30:00 - 01:32:58
We got no money to spend, give us some free drinks. Let's do it. Exactly. In all seriousness, despite the incompatibility, you both still learned relational skills. And that's what ultimately what relationships are about as you're relating to someone else, right? So I don't think anybody should ever say I spent so much time dating people that weren't right for me because those people who are not right for you are prepping you for the person who is right for you. So thank you for being on board and being open minded to that. Oh, thanks so much for the adventure. This is definitely fascinating. Yeah, for sure. I learned so much in such a short amount of time. It was wild. I think I'm gonna definitely do dating differently now. Love it. That's right. Fabulous. Then, well, thank you so much for being part of the experiment and thank you all for listening to this experiment. If you love this experiment, if you want to sign up for a new one that we have down the line, just you can DM us or email us. You just go on a website, they will podcast dot com or better yet, give us a 5 star rating in Apple podcasts and then we'll put you at the top of the list. That's how you get in, all right? Okay. We're gonna wrap up this episode in true dateable fashion. The dateable podcast is part of the frolic podcast network, find more podcasts you'll love at frolic media slash podcasts. Want to continue the conversation? First, follow us on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter with the handle at dateable podcast. Tagas in any post with a hashtag stay dateable and trust us. We look at all those posts. Then head over to our website dateable podcast dot com. There you'll find all the episodes as well as articles, videos and our coaching service with vetted industry experts. You can also find our premium Y series where we dissect analyze and offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums. We're also downloadable for free on Spotify, Apple podcasts, Google Play, overcast, stitch radio, and other podcast platforms. Your feedback is valuable to us, so don't forget to leave us a review. And most importantly, remember to. Stay dateable. University of Maryland global campus has more than 20 years experience providing affordable online education to military service members and working adults, offering low tuition, no cost digital resources replacing most textbooks, scholarships for those who qualify and more. Learn more at UMG dot EDU slash podcast. Holidays are here, and so is fashionable fitness. Gift yourself a Samsung galaxy Z flip three 5G, a phone that folds in half to literally stand on its own. Pair it with the galaxy watch four for ultimate wellness and wow factor. Check health stats, flex personal records, over 90 activities can be tracked, like biking, swimming, golfing, and more, invest in yourself, with tech made to crush goals. Holidays open up with galaxy, shop at all at Samsung dot com, 5G connection and availability may vary. Check with carrier products sold separately.