Andrew tells us about his many dates over the last 8 years in SF, where not even one has turned into a real relationship. We talk about how technology has made us pass quicker, judge faster (thanks, google and social media), and how to thrive through it all.
S3E14 Dating Fatigue
00:00:00 - 00:05:01
The Dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that the Huffington post calls one of the top ten podcast about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about. From sex parties to sex droughts, date fails a diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host Yue Xu, former dating coach turned dating sociologists. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Krafchick as we explored this crazy dateable world.
And i move so i loves. We are excited. You've join us for an older episode. While our earlier seasons were all about dating in san francisco we quickly realize all the themes. Learnings are universal for all daters so we shifted to covering dating from all around the world as the seasons progress. The fun part is things happen. I san francisco the tech and counterculture capital of the world. We love for you to keep tuning in to our older episodes. But there's no set order to listen in so feel free to jump to more. Recent seasons are relevant episodes for you. Enjoy the show. The dateable podcast is hosted by me. I'm you a a former dating coach. In new york turned active data in san francisco on each episode. you'll hear commentary by my co host. Michael vargas fellow dating coach with a clinical psychology background. My producer craft check and other surprise co host stay tuned until the end of the episode for fun dating fact presented by our partner lively a new dating app that uses videos to tell your story by the way we started a t shirt line. And we're pretty sure. These teachers will make killer presents for the holidays. So check it out on our website at dateable. Podcast dot com. Everyone welcome to another episode of dateable. Show that opens up a candid. Conversation about dating and san francisco and on each episode we dissect a dating story and today we have andrew andrew. Are you there. Yes i am. Aren't andrew tell us your story. Well i've been living in san francisco for almost a decade grew up in the bay area. And you know dating is always been a very interesting weird affair on and you know like everybody else in the city. I tend to be very busy. I've gone on and more dating app. Updates than i can count on and it's always just been a very interesting yet. Usually short lived experience. In one instance. I was on a date and in the middle of the date. The winning question looks up at me. In south sudan says. Sorry this isn't gonna work out. And when i asked why yeah and you know we have long common. We did a lot of stuff. We were interested in the same things. And i thought the day was going really. Well we were laughing. Each other's jokes go great report but sh- their reasoning was and i quote we know too many of the same people l. l. i. She's in very tight. Knit community like a performing community so everybody knows everybody and she was just kind of looking to go outside of that. Andrew i can totally relate to this. Yeah totally because this is. Why don't i try to date as little as possible in san francisco. Not only do you have these. Little communities are so tight and everybody knows everyone. San francisco in general is just very small and everyone knows everyone. Everyone's dated everyone so it is kind of a for lack of better words. It's kinda yucky to date someone who you have. So many mutual friends with so is there more to the story. Andrew i mean again we still know the same people and we sold chat and were kind of friendly and we hang out once in a while but it's but it was just a disappointing aspect so amyloid perplex because your story seems to be kind of a normal story i mean. I think that this happens to a lot of people. I've heard of the but the fact that you you've chosen to tell the story on our podcast on means that it bothers you. So let's talk about why this bothers you so much in the eight years or nine years living in the city. I've as i mentioned earlier. I've been on two different dates. And you know i'm not sure if it's just the city or if it's our culture or if it's the technology that we have available or if it's way that we were brought up but it just seems that dating in the city is incredibly hard in this excuse to kind of break things off or not even explorer it almost like a will. This is the last you know i. That's it. I'm throwing in the towel. i've kind of experienced it all. I've been ghosted. At one point i got stocked at one point. A lot of it almost feels like this. Remember friends as well that that you know.
00:05:01 - 00:10:01
It's all or nothing like hell. Hell no situation. You know what i mean. It's like you have like a date or a few minutes within the date at this point to even be able to you know. Feel the other person out back in the day. People date people they get to know over time. So those feelings in that attraction has developed over facetime. Not not facetime from iphone. If i'm like actual facetime but nowadays we feel like we must feel something in that first date or in the first five minutes and if we don't feel it we must swipe for this person or delete or you know. Throw away this person. So i guess the question is this is obviously something that's affected by dating apps as creating this kind of behavior where we can swipe people even in person but two. It's like this is a great way to filter for people who do think this way right. This is obviously girl who made her judgment very quickly. whether that's an valid. Excuse or not who cares. Because she's obviously not interested so she may heard her judgment very quickly. This is not someone you wanna be with anyway. She wasn't going to put in the time to get to know you so whatever she can go. Swipe the next guy. Obviously she's not right for you so andrew. I've also lived here for six years. So not as long as you up there in the scheme of san francisco as wondering what your thoughts are of. How san francisco. Dating his changed in the last few years since become more mainstream i will say there's way more poly people out there And they're way more open about it. Which is very interesting for someone who got introduced to that concept while living in san francisco While i've been living here it's changed quite a bit from the perspective of. Hey that's something that very interesting that you're interested in. It's not my thing but it's very cool that you're interested in it to we have to. You have to meet these very specific specifications almost like ordering a computer. Oh you're modems. Not what i'm looking for. Well sorry. I'm going to try to find the next model. We use the grill list article up. He read that. And i do think it's overtly negative on a little negative the article but there was a line from it. A people felt like nsf. Everyone was looking for the next hot app and there was like how they were feldman dealing and it was like. We're going to beta test. You move onto the next thing. That's out there. So i thought that was an interesting analogy. That comes just said winded. Now that's that's that's perfect. That's exactly what i what's been rolling around my head and i haven't really been able to. I haven't been able to put into words. One woman that i was a that i went on a date with basically we met up and when i had to go up and go to the restroom when i came back she wanted to end the date and again this is this win at a moment when it seemed really nice we had a good rapport. You know she was funny and apparently thought that my complete memorization of the princess bride was a pretty redeeming quality but she wanted to end it so it ended so when i asked her what's up. She said that she had googled me. While i was away. And i i am a bit of a bernie supporter or not. Like bernie bro like attack. Why does she had found a couple of tweets. Where i had you know reach weeded. Some issues about bernie and some support for bernie and she was like yeah. I am a hillary supporter. This will never work way. She did all of this while you were in the bathroom. I've i've heard of this happening a lot. More is maybe not during the bathroom break. But of of people googling and checking people linked in facebook before they go out on dates. Is that something that you've ever thought to full background check. I have like a membership at this background. Check company. I mean i do a full background check because i keep hearing nightmare stories of girls going on dates with guys were like convicted felons or had like written really controversial articles about women in the past. You know like. I just don't want to get. I don't wanna waste my time with people like that with online dating. You have no idea where you're going to get so i do. I actually do my homework but at the same time to a fault. Because i do think i know a little bit too much about that person when i go in. Go on this date. Cheaper like he went on your quiche young actually talked to. It's super awkward. When i know they're ex-girlfriend through all my research and i'm like oh i just want to bring up her name right now but i can't. Do you feel like that's actually. Do you think it's benefiting or harming dating. I think it's like glad to do a criminal records check.
00:10:01 - 00:15:03
Maybe i don't think you need to go through someone's full linked in facebook and instagram To get to know them. Like i actually think on tinder when someone links or instagram automatically. Swipe left for them. This is tim i. I don't need to know that much information. I like a little mystery to your. This person that i'm about to meet but i do think that in in this this is going back to your point andrew about you know like the influx of dating apps in how people keep thinking about the next hot thing or next best thing. This is across the country. Okay this is not just san francisco. It's just in san francisco. We feel we feel like it's more amplified one because the community is smaller. Shoot is here but i think that the thing we need to think about is. It's not so much the these apps. It's the access that we have to information. We just always have so much information that we think that where we meet someone. We already have enough information about them to judge them back. In the day there was mystery. There was a getting to know each other process. And i almost feel like that phase of getting to know each other is a little bit obsolete now and with that too. It's like you're learning about someone through contents but you're not learning their context. No not at all exactly. The the good news is okay. Everyone who has been on this podcast. I can guarantee you is in the same boat. Everyone feels that this is something that's happening. They're fighting it. They don't they don't want to date people who have already fallen into that black hole so there's still a lot of us out there. We just need to find each other. Maybe we should start a support group or something to me. It doesn't make a lot of sense to use apps because you're just rolling the dice. It's a real roller dies. But when you're out there meeting people you get that experience with them and you know we have those moments only. I meet someone in the first five minutes whether we want to talk to them or not. Further on well with online. It's just really a roll of the dice. We take away from the fact that i actually experience of how important that is to make a deciding factor of what we can do with it for the future. Do want to continue it on or not in online. You don't have any choice like that. All you have as a little bit of words that they typed up that you can't really judge what it really means but it may not be a bad thing right like online. There's a lot of benefits your opening up to people. You wouldn't have met in the in the first place. I think you just have to different mindset about it. You have to expect that you're go on tons of first second third dates that ne- never go anywhere and you're almost. The first date isn't really been a date. It's just like a meat. I feel like okay. So i'm gonna completely disagree with this. I actually think that we should change our mindset and start vetting the people we go on dates with more like we should. Our goal shouldn't be going on so many first and second dates thinking that some of them may not go anywhere. I always bring on my girlfriend in new york. I hope she listens to this. She's had over like thousands of matches on tinder. She goes on like two or three dates a day and at some point it becomes a job. It's a meet and greet it's not real anymore. This is why. I think we just got a vet better. Choose better know better. What what you're looking for and the person you go on a date with that person's going to hold a lot more weight than you just going out. This is a numbers game. So i really like people don't like this. I like talking on the phone before we meet. I like face timing before we meet. I like that because then you get a sense of who that person is. And i feel like we're neglecting andrew for a little bit andrew. I really think before you throw in the towel. Because i'm very passionate about this there. Is someone out there. But before you throw in the towel just change your mindset and change your methodology is really think i mean look at us. There's like four of us right now in the same boat. You're going to find other people who are also in the same boat appreciated. I'm not saying that. Like i give up. Hope because you know. I didn't throw in the talent. So you know gone out there and hanging out One question though you mentioned talking on the phone. I have noticed that a lot of people just really are uncomfortable with talking on the phone absolutely. It's so funny. When i moved to san francisco to me. I think it's a little bit of a san francisco thing. Because when i moved here i asked. I kept asking people for their number like just people. I wanted to meet when i started meeting. People and i kept getting weird. Looks an acid buddy of mine. What the what that's about. And he's like dude. No one talks on the phone anymore. Like what since. When does that happen. But i agree. People are more reluctant to give up a cell phone number to talk. Yes definitely but for the people who are willing to talk on the phone. They deserve your time and you deserve to give them more of your time as well.
00:15:03 - 00:20:02
I think because we're also a little bit of trouble on the phone having that for step being a phone call definitely filters out the people you don't wanna be with just thought i don't know i mean i have a lot of girlfriends who are like i would never do it. But honestly if they liked the guy enough or think they like the guy enough or they think there's a potential there. They'll get on the phone with him. That might be a good way to like you. Were saying earlier to vet if the person's not willing to talk on the phone then maybe this might not be someone that you want to kind of look further into the first thing that pumped the to mind was like you know you're willing to meet with somebody in e possibly incredibly awkward for half hour to multiple hours but you're not willing to just chat on the phone which is a safer in be. You can end it whenever the hell you want. Oh yeah. I remember back in the day. The rejection hotline anyone. Yeah yeah yeah yeah explain. Explain it for the kids who don't know what that is. Okay so back. In the day read there was a number that you can give out and if someone if someone asked you for your number and you felt uncomfortable about giving number you can give them. What's called the rejection hotline number. And it's basically when they call that number it. Lets the personnel that. That's actually not the person's real number and that they have been rejected will do there was actually multiple of there was the nice rejection. There was the swearing rejection. There was a couple of a friend of mine actually actually used to use that all the time and she had multiple ones depending on what how aggressive the dude was or Whether or not she like wants let him down easy. And i think i didn't think there was a celebrity one with like or somebody like that texting now or something man you guys. That's so sad. I don't wanna get a rejection text. No no that's horrible. I would cry like at least with the rejection phone. Call you here at once. And you're like damn. I was rejected as a rejection tags on your phone until you deleted. that's terrible. i don't i don't want that. I think it'd be good for people who are douchebag very. Yeah definitely you guys. Let's wrap this up. I'm gonna throw in the of the day. This question comes from armand about dating san francisco when you live at your parents. House sends. housing costs are so crazy. Here one how do i bring up this topic. Immature and masculine way on the first or second date when the girls usually have nice jobs and have their own plays and two things progress between us. How do i navigate the logistics of going to replace or something else for privacy. I fumbled the explanation of mu living at home with a few girls leading to several rejections overtaxed after the first date our mind this is a this is a great one. The question the first question. I would ask is. Why are you living with your parents. But if if you're living with your parents because you're saving up money to go to graduate school or something like that. I think that's something that can be. You can of spin that in a more positive light if you're someone that you're living with your your parents because you don't have a job and you're having a hard time finding one. I don't think he should be going out on dates just yet. I think you need to be like to be honest. I think you need to focus on just getting your shit together. I'm not saying this makes you a good person. I'm just saying. I think there are other priorities. If you're living with your parents in san francisco yes it's very expensive but there's ways to get around and with roommates and such so. The question is really. Why are you living with your parents. You need to have i navigate wire living at home us and then i don't know about that. That's a hard one other than like the hotels for the night. I don't a there. You can do free unique to be honest with the girl dating her place. Yeah i think that's and then when you're ready to take the step to need parents and all that and you can bring your to your place. Don't do that prematurely until you're ready to make that step if you are you saving your money and actively acting fiscally responsible and all that sort of stuff and you a a lady that actually appreciates that and appreciates you then. The logistic should kind of work themselves out and coming from a girl's perspective. I'm only representing myself here. I would never have data guy who lived at home with his parents but if he had a plan like if this was not permanent and he said you know what i want to take you on these dates. I wanted to start dating. You do live at home with my parents right now but i will be moved out in two months.
00:20:02 - 00:23:56
I'm just saving enough money for the deposit or you know or whatever then i'm like okay. He has a plan at least and he can communicate that and can whatever you can stay over at my place or we can hotel take the next two months. If it's like a permanent thing then. That is a huge turnoff. I definitely arbor question for usa. He's living with his parents but the reason he hasn't moved out yes because he wants to use his money for like big events like limousine rides here like bottle service everywhere like just crazy stuff like that. What what are your thoughts about that. And it doesn't have to be going wildly crazy drunk but just like being able to live the big life. What are your thoughts Say grow up. What's i don't need bottle service. I don't need a limousine. I need a bed without your mom. Walking in on us having sex. Is that too much to ask life. i don't know my sanders are high. Maybe like i think legitimate reasons would be. I'm saving up for a down payment on a house. I want to buy and say go damn okay. But then you'll be living in your parents house for the next ten years but at least you're trying to buy something or you're saving up for grad school in which case i don't want you anyway because you're about to go to grad school so again. I totally agree with you michael. Get the get the excuses down. I really be honest and upfront with y. You're living at home. How much time are you allowing yourself to be at home. And do you have a plan for the future but just be honest. I think honesty is the best policy in this situation. Some girls some girls like it. Some people were kinky or like. Yeah i like that. You know your parents walk in. Some people want to relive their high school days. You know. that's like part of their fantasy scraper role play but on that note listeners. At home don't forget to send me your stories. I remember you can always be anonymous. We can change your name and the names of people involved in your story work before that i want to say. Thank you andrew. First time on this show and Stay dateable here's the dating fact brought to you by lively a new video dating app and we have cat from lively here cat. What are some ways that people can be more successful at dating we have some stats about what people put in their profiles and whether that leads to more or less messages surprisingly profiles that mentioned being laid back got fifty percent less messages fifty percent yes and on the other hand those profiles. That mentioned being ambitious didn't do well either. They resulted in thirty eight percent fewer messages so cap. What's what's someone supposed to do. They can't be laid back and they can't. I mean. I think that you know people. Of course you should be laid back and you should be ambitious but the takeaway here is just don't be generic if you're online dating right now. You should be looking at what your competition looks like. Get on your friend. Who's an opposite sex or opposite gender of right like get on their profile and swipe through their options and just see what other people who are like you what they're writing and just don't right whether whatever right yeah you i mean going through dating profiles if i see. I'm laid back back timely back. Oh you're so interesting. No so just be more unique great takeaway. Thanks cat and things lively for that dating fact videos. Tell your story better. Download the lively dating app today at go lively app. Dot com to connect with us visit dateable. Podcast dot com. You can also find us on facebook twitter and instagram. All under dateable podcasts.