Margot tells us about her new approach to finding love and how she’s breaking the “rules” of dating. We discuss social constructs that disadvantage women, how to cut through the BS of dates that don’t go anywhere, and the necessity of direct up-front communication.
S7E9 Rewriting the Rules Part 1
00:00:00 - 00:05:00
The Dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that the Huffington post calls one of the top ten podcast about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about. From sex parties to sex droughts, date fails a diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host Yue Xu, former dating coach turned dating sociologists. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Krafchick as we explored this crazy dateable world.
This episode of dateable is brought to you by five hundred brunches. Five hundred branches connects like minded people with similar interests to meet in real life over brunch. You answer a questionnaire about your interest and how you spend your time. And then they'll match you. In small groups of sixty eight at a brunch spot. In san francisco get a free entry into a brench now by signing up at five hundred brunches dot com and using the code date able. Hey everyone welcome to another episode of dateable. Show all about modern defeating. Let's talk about just dating after getting out of a serious relationship and then sort of relearning with modern dating is all about dating apps. And the dating. Do's and the dating does not rule and then throwing out the rules in say. Fuck it to the rules here here to talk about. Her name is margot. She's thirty one years old from boston. She's been in san francisco for thirteen years. Yeah really long time. I came out here for college. And just never let and would you so many bus onians on the show. We've had we have here because we're very directed people here have trouble with is. It's true we need more of that though. Margot has been using dating apps for quite some time after getting out of a serious relationship five years ago. Helen was that relationship for We live together for about six years while. Okay really sears. And she has. Let's start off with this funny story. I i don't know much about it but you had a moment where you arrived at a bar for a date and then what happened. It was a classic example of like margot trying to put herself out. It had been a little while. Since i had gone on a first date so it was kind of nervous and i walked into cafe news and there is a guy sitting by himself at a table and we meet i contact and waved at me so was like okay whatever and i sat down and we just like immediately started chatting. Didn't introduce ourselves. Because i was just kind of nervous. And whatever and you know he kind of looked like the guy that i was gonna. They're see but i didn't really pay that much attention to it. What sort of date was supposed to be. Wait with like a bumble okay. It was the first date and we started talking. And i was like. Oh so. You're from the boston area. Six seven area code. He's like oh. No danville and i was like. Oh maybe i'd like research the wrong guy or slinging every now and then you know. We were talking and looking at the wine list. And then he's like so. How was oxford like us. It was great and he's like. Oh where'd you just like traveling abroad. And i was like. I'm pretty sure on the wrong day or eight now and i kinda just ran away. I was so embarrassed. Wait you go to a bar. You're supposed to show up for the bumbled date and this guy was. There is supposed to meet a date as well. Yeah claire online. Dating to any thought you were the girl he was supposed to meet. I guess so. Yeah so quickly to this date. Find out that you're not there on the right down ten to twelve minutes when we realized that it was definitely the wrong date. As you order. Your wine at this point had not ordered the move. Thank you ran away. I was so embarrassed only god. I think we're on the wrong date. I felt another bus sonian thing. I hate being late. So i felt. Oh my actual data not just like oh my god sorry by and my actual date was sitting at the bar and of course i walked up and immediately told him what had happened because they thought it was hilarious but definitely didn't set a great town for the he probably thought nothing of it because everyone's perpetually ten minutes later yes mortified by this day was super late so eventually i go to the bar and the bartender is like oh my god. I saw the hoping go down. That was hilarious. And she apparently met her fiance unable to but So she was a so eventually his date shows up in. The bartender went over to take their order and she comes back. She decker looks. Nothing like you think. You've just happy that he sat down to talking to. But did your guy looked like this guy. I totally get it though. It's like you see this little photo right and it's but there's always that awkward it you walk into the same after a certain point anyway. Whatever i was like oh this is was supposed to be brown. This guy has blue eyes like there are a couple things. I always try to like. Be like a wearing like this guy.
00:05:00 - 00:10:02
So yeah but i've totally have not. I've never sat down on the wrong. But like i've had that look around and like where is by date and it's someone that looks nothing like the foul. It's so awkward. That is like the dewey handshake or hugging like so. I always go for the handshake. They usually go for the hug. And it's like you know it's the first time they meet somebody kind of establishing boundaries for yourself anything that just more appropriate to shake hands. People are just so awkward about it that they try to let go for the hug and it's like well we'll four mall so i could see but i feel like you do kinda me to earn a hug. Say that's true. Yeah it's awkward. i don't know. I change it up for the handshake and they do hog and we do the handshake shake hug as like super awkward. When you leave. That's awkward do like. Do i go in for a hug. Now do i was this happened to me. What else am i allowed on this like. I always seem to run into people that i've gone on like one or two dates with all the time like there's one guy that lives on my block so i constantly see him. There's another guy that. I would see starbucks all the time and we had like the starbucks sky because i'd see him like literally every week. Yeah but we just ignored each other and pretended like we didn't know each other because we have one day we're in it didn't go like it was just like one of those things that it was not a good date. So i'm guilty of to like i feel like i should acknowledge him but i didn't but now became too long. That's weird. Have you guys ever bumped into people know. Probably i probably just like if it's if it's not gonna go that as probably just forget about them. You're like whatever. Yeah i i've never i just feel like it's to approach them. It didn't work out. Yeah but you still acknowledge it. Hey how's it going. I i did should so. I think it would be funny. Julie you for yourself should to break the rules in steel. Like hey man. How's it going up to a speaking of breaking the rules you wrote in and said you said this breaking the rules of dating many of the social contracts in place greatly disadvantaged women early upfront communication can give us the information. We need to make decisions and weed out. Folks who's dating goals aren't aligned. The sounds like the thesis statement to some sort of paper sociology. Wanna one but fifties a statement for the paper. I met him in my head about like. How do i actually want to approach things from now on so when you say. Many of the social constructs in place greatly disadvantaged women. What does that mean. well. I think that i should probably say greatly advantage women who actually looking for a relationship. Okay 'cause people are like in all different places. People are just really look into a have a good time. Some you know i mean it's there's definitely such a wide variety of what people want but i think is not really valued people just sort of like wander around each other and don't you know it's like women are always leading for men district choose them and i feel like i don't know there is no direct upfront communication and a lot of the dating have experienced and i've had situations where i'll date somebody for like three months and then things are going great. Everything seems to be going fine. But there's never like a conversation like hey what do you actually want. Where are you at. And then like three months and it'll be like oh hey like just so you know you know i actually kinda like wanna be single work on myself right now. I can't see like taking the next step in like i've had enough of those conversations Like i don't want to be in that position anymore. Because i really don't want to waste another three months knowing what i know about myself where i wanna be. If what i'm hearing from you is that these are your own personal spirit experiences and they have a lot of my friends too. Okay okay. What are these social constructs that you're talking about then the the fact that you know the guy who does the choosing like if it's going to go somewhere or not Not why why. I let guys that maybe my own stuff so more historic gender roles but i think it was a thing if you read any of the dating books out there. It's like do text him. I do not like wait. A certain amount of time. Don't immediately reply games. I admit like i used to do that stuff in. It never actually helped me any on the relationship i finished. That's actually gone somewhere. It's ditched all of that absolutely. Yeah so i guess. What are you doing taniguchi. Power dynamic. It's like you know the second that you start like initiating texting whatever they like go away. It's like now all of this weird stuff. Do you believe that or do you feel like that's not the case. If i don't know. I mean it might not be the case that it's been my experience. I think get like a little bit spooked when you're more direct. Was there like a breaking moment. Was there a specific person that you were like this is not. I'm not being true to myself or a series of things that happened. Well i guess. I don't know i think that my dating life in san francisco for the past five years has been like up like a beer game.
00:10:02 - 00:15:03
Duck duck goose. It's like it's like you know you got like noncommittal sucked boy. Sociopath is like oh my god where the good ones. And i just realized that i had these patterns and was ending up spending time with the same types of people and a lot of those people that i was meeting very noncommittal and i'm not sure why that was like girls out of the marina or some big event at the sounds like you're picking the wrong men girl. Oh will that's for sure. I don't i certainly don't think it's modern think you're picking the wrong you're paying and that you're probably very drawn to their assertiveness and a masculinity right at the same time you're not respecting yourself enough to tell them what you're looking for a right Yeah so what. Are you doing now here. This breaking the rules communicating more. I think i made a promise to myself that you know. Obviously the first couple dates are to see if you actually want to be around this person in read more time with them But that is the case that on both sides said the third date. I just kind of have a general conversation about like what you actually looking for like. Where are where you add in your in your shrimp dating one of your goals. Were you looking for just have like a really casual conversation about that. Just to understand to have information that i need to understand where they're out if that aligns with where i'm at so why date number i don't know it's just something that take. Okay i guess maybe just see. It's worth having that conversation. Like if i don't even like you person need to know exactly and and if if that's the case i don't like them as a person than there probably won't be third or vice versa. For some reason they just fall off conversation to have to answer so when you talk about upfront. Communication weeding out folks who's dating goals aren't aligned. Is just really talking about what are you looking for. Yeah i mean some people are are loving. The single life mets totally great Are looking for something more substantial some people. It is kind of a gold rush town so i feel like some folks aren't necessarily looking to stay here are settled down and more find somebody here so just getting that information upfront. They can make a decision first of all. What have been the responses. Since you've had these conversations. I guess since since i sort of me this role of myself i only dated one person in. It's gone really. Well i mean we sort of made a joke out of it even our first date that that we're just gonna talk about everything you're not supposed to talk about on the first day with it so i love. That was great and just like really. Well we got into politics religion Yeah what we're actually looking for. And it was all very well aligned. He actually was like hey. Do you wanna come bowling with my friends. So he likes me. No went up bullying in the david from five thirty to like one. Am when he walked me to my door so great guy still dating. so what I guess what are you looking for. I am definitely looking to have a serious relationship with somebody that could could lead somewhere to marriage. Yeah i totally love. Marriage babies the whole the whole night. Gotcha and you told this guy flat out all that well here that came to the realization. What happened i i really i hate him acuity and dislike. When you're dating somebody for so long in there's no pathway and you have no idea where you stand if they even really like you if you're with you that Session uncomfortable feeling for me that when you're that when you have that much discomfort for that long sitting in that discomfort just because you think you're pleasing somebody else when you know maybe they're uncomfortable to nato know what you think them in reality but know that's usually what i like. Fuck things up. But i'm just like really uncomfortable and don't ask going on. It's like when i start getting weird overthinking or doubting myself and doubting the situation expire but it we also do that with our friends thing. We feed off of our friends. Your friends have the same kind of mentality when it comes to dating like. You said you know i. I had these experiences. Dating a lot of my friends did to right heart of grown up and becoming an adult learning to listen to what you want in the acting on that. We've tested my experience. You know. I think that some of my single girlfriends are also coming into that realization. That is just about blowing. Valuing yourself more and really which i don't even ever devalued myself but i certainly wasn't sticking up for what i wanted and needed now anything that there's a lot of conditioning that girls grow up with that very much about like being agreeable up and just being the nice girl being. There's this good girl. Batgirls economy that we deal with. That has a lot to do with pleasing other people. And it's confusing when you really try to adhere to that and be like a girl by societal standards but then you realize that you're really not getting what you want or need and you kind of have two teams that contract within yourself early. I have had really reevaluate that thing about like but how is advocating for things that i want a need. How does that make me a bad girl or bad person. If i know what. I'm worth business situation willing to negotiate for myself there. Why can't i do that with my heart and symbol as a really great point.
00:15:03 - 00:20:02
I know personally this resonates with me because i have had issues also kind of stealing my needs in. That's when resentment happens to. So like i think just like having those conversations in putting it out like goes along in so many ways. I think that people can be a little bit uncomfortable with real conversations or whatever but it's way better than the discomfort of sitting for months and months without knowing what's happening so i'm interested in this idea of a good girl versus bad girl won some actions of a good girl. I think that's changing for me in my own head. Yeah it's interesting. I think this is probably different for a lot of different women. Based on have they raised in survi- conditioning. You get a lot of. It is kind of societal staff earlier in my twenties. Sort of asking for what i wanted. It advocating for myself. I might think about as more selfish. You know sort of like baggio behaviors which you know now learning. That's totally acceptable in. Great to do would say agreeable. I think oh yeah like a people pleaser as probably girl. Yeah in a bad girl like you said selfish and like stubborn or like way not agreeable. Yeah not agreeable. Yeah there's some. You know their stereotypes of your good girl. Who does everything morally right. Which is up for debate whether her you know what that may be. But there aren't as many very concrete actions of good girl. As opposed to a bad girl in this society we jumped to shaming bad girl behavior much more than praising good girl like sleeping with someone on the was someone may or state but look at the two that girl the whole like slut shaming thing. It's like a guy girl sleep together early on and the guy's like oh you're a slide in they dumped but it's like what are you. What does that make so many double standards that you run into Also have so many friends that are now married. That slept with several that. I d f. They it wasn't like they were doing this all the time necessarily but if the connection was there an i personally have strong opinions on this that i don't think it matters like i think if you sleep with someone and there's no connection doesn't matter if it's the first date or like the tense eight but that's just my opinion not hold the same opinion but i think that's definitely historic like of. This is a bad girl. But that's obviously very much changing society yet. Also the other thing that's kind of changing is that people are embracing the bad girl behavior. You know there's shows about bad girl behaviors moms and dads and it's cool jab bad. It's like cool to sleep with some of them. I say it's cool. Delight bitch someone because they did something to you. But when i watch these shows all these women are doing is basically standing up for themselves. Yeah right but that's Love this good girl. Bad girl no. It's totally problem. Exactly italy problem bag. That's what i'm saying. Let's break it all down in built something that works for us. And that's a personal thing that you know different things for different people but personally for me. The good girl bad girl thing is not working other. Throw it out all combination of good girl and background. Yeah he's just a good girl and nobody's just bad girl and it's good to embrace both sides but everyone has different definitions of what good and bad the very end of the day. You like what you like i. I'm so really surprised by the notion when you said Men do the choosing. Yeah totally something that yeah. I'm actually very surprised at this notion still among women because i felt like a died down but i now realized that women do feel this way still but a lot of men would argue. That women do the choosing right. Oh the conversation though about like are we going to be boyfriend and girlfriend or whatever you call it so that so that's also the surprising thing is like if this is your life and you want to take your relationship to the next level is it a question of. Who's the one to i. She ate scatter station. It's time to take a quick break so we can tell you about the latest service. We have been building over here at dateable. We've created a platform to connect you with vetted experts from our network to help with everything from coaching dating therapy dating profile reviews and even ways to get real feedback about your dating style a session sickly run from thirty minutes to an hour. And can all be done via skype or google hangouts so you can be anywhere listeners. Sharing how worthwhile their sessions have been with comments about how easy the coaches are to talk to how they have provided a new perspective and how they have created actionable ways to inspire change to meet the coaches and book. Your session today visit dateable podcasts. Dot com slash coaching. Now back to the shelf. Why is it a question of who's the one to create this conversation headed. The guy like frustrates me. That people and men do the same thing men are like. I'm waiting for the girl to say. Or i'm waiting for her to give me signals for you. Know bet that were exclusive will.
00:20:02 - 00:25:05
Why are we waiting around for someone else to initiate when this is something you want if you want it you bring it up. And if your partner's not aligned and get them out of the relationship right in this. I've had bad experiences doing that. In initiating it there is a guy that i was seeing a few years ago and we were like on and off like casual relationship for a couple of years and he would not be in a committed relationship with me you know. Which in retrospect. I'm really got out but i kinda loved him in so is really hard once emotions. Get involved in you really care about him. I harder to your stand up for yourself and get out of it because like shit. You left the person you're gonna do looking back on it. I'm like oh my gosh. I would never get back together with him him or want to be in a relationship like that but at the time it was just a really challenging thing to navigate one point i was like how are we not boyfriend and girlfriend like yard. You know doing everything together. We're spending all this time together. You know we're going on trips together and all of that. How are we not in relation to be finding the kind of our but it was just like there is no emotional safety there whatsoever. I think that's what it is though. It's the fear of losing it and especially like if you are emotionally invested. Which is why it's early on like you're saying the battery. Yeah exactly the information you need right. He's i have personally been there as well that lake. There's a notion that you could change them. You that glimmer of hope right but we need to serve renting out these like old school notion because there are still remnants of them. Don't hell and it's still feeds into how we date in how we be relationships. But we can't be scared to have these conversations. I think the reason to why we're scared. How these conversations that were scared the answer that we're going to get fast. The situation we know. What are you gonna get ending hundred percent that scenario that your partners not on the same page. You're probably not on the same page. You're probably right and also like people always say. I don't want to scare him away. Yeah i don't. I don't wanna move things too fast but again everyone's on their own time line so you're ready for the next step. You should express your needs and instead of thinking about like scaring someone off it's about aligning your needs like you said in the beginning margot it's i will express you. I need this relationship. Are you off the same page with your needs. And my fulfilling your needs are fulfilling my needs if we're not. Can we work towards that moore. Should we cut nestle oudlay. So i think instead of thinking about this scaring your partner away or doing something wrong. You're just trying to figure out of your partnership works. that's it. I think it all goes back to communication again. How you sat not what you say because if you just demand like basically like i'm gonna leave if this doesn't happen a tabby Examiner automated like. It's really how you say in like yes communication just so important. I have Somebody close to me. Who has been in a relationship been married. I've been in a relationship for fourteen years. And they never learn how to communicate and asked they never learn you know. They're both kind of conflict. Avoidance in things would build up and they just wouldn't address it now you know they're they're going through separation period in the good thing is that they're working on communication. They're now working on these things. But i can't imagine being with somebody for fourteen years and just just toying around each other. Say be surprised how people are. Yeah i think that's what it comes down to two league. We're saying that you're afraid of the answer gonna get but then. I think it's like having the courage to like actually remember like well if i actually am really with this person like do i want to be tiptoeing around. If i can't have a conversation. I can't hear the way they react a need that i need to know how that is going to be. Ideally if you are with somebody you know you're in it for the good and the bad because that's how life is there is and there are downs. And you need to be together on the same page because you're both gonna go through periods of instability and whatnot through the course of your life and you have to know that this person is going to have your back and you're going to have. There's definitely talked about this therapy. I think for me. Like i would just be like okay. We disagree like this could be a deal breaker like end. We're like fights. And disagreements don't necessarily have to be the end at any way. It's more like this is where my needs are. This is where i'm coming from. Can you work with this. Yeah maybe building of your own brian. Griese and figuring out what you wanna need how that works with another person because that's always it's two people coming together who have different exactly lake. I sometimes can be neurotic about like plans. And i get a lot of people from boston. Yeah i hear that. I get a lot of people especially that are from california or a little more like lucy with it. So it's like maybe there's a middle it's not like what works for me isn't gonna necessarily work for them and it's like finding that middle ground with someone in couples therapy. They teach you negotiations. There's mean couples and it's not about compromise is about negotiating so the way they teach.
00:25:05 - 00:30:02
You is one person states. This is my need this. My need comes from the feeling. And would you consider doing this yup etc. One example is. I'm feeling unsupported in this relationship. I need more support from you. Would you consider sitting down with me once a week to talk about some of my insecurities like that could be one ago. She and your partner comes back and says i hear your need. I validate your feelings. Now would you consider sitting down I will take you up on your offer once a week. Would you consider sitting down with me once a week and talking about my insecurity so a negotiation and the end goals never like rb right for each other. It's rice. how do we work towards a better partnership and the the reason why they teach you. This is because if you don't communicate in a way of negotiation then that's when the game playing comes when you shoot a better couple's therapist that i did the major takeaway was it. You never wanna leave room for assumptions. If there is a little bit of room for assumption that's when a game playing starts and that's when people become very black and white in their decisions. I'm gonna end this relationship and test. How he feels people do this. All the time. The testing like playing games. And that's what ruins of religion. That person does your testing that they think that you do schefter up by someone else and that the other partnership. That's iverson's you battle. I think what does it say or what you said the way you said. It was very different to than like accusing someone of like. Oh you make me feel insecure. Do that have to keep it about how you feel. It's not necessarily that a person. I think this is true for a lot of things people. There's this whole saying like oh this person should make me happy or this person. Make me this way. But that's not their job in that kind of pressure on somebody is just kind of. Oh yeah it's not up to a person to make you happy up to yourself to be in a place where you can be happy and maybe you can be having with the person you can't but it's no one's job and make you happy. That was like the jerry. Maguire like out lash attack at the us. Like you complete me. It's like no. I was completed before. I we all found so romantic. Ten years ago. Problem is that you have to know again in dating and relationships you have to know what you have control over and what you don't have control over you do not have control over what your partner thinks or does you don't have control over or feels but you have control over your own feelings and your own actions your partner like you said margot cannot make you happy but you can allow your partner to make you feel happy the difference so when when we look at dating as well. I know so many people who are like. Oh my gosh so waiting for this phone call. Oh waiting for this text back and making me upset. We had a girlfriend who cancelled on event. Because a guy didn't text back and and made her so upset. That is really unfortunate because this is your life and you can control your life and you can live the way you want to live and to have someone else gives them an elsa power yet. Have you kissed your lands right. Trucked your life. That is really unfortunate. You really have to evaluate your relationship at this point. Yeah i also feel about yourself and how you feel about your time. yes yes. But we can't overcompensate for that we get a bunch of very strong women were like. I don't need no man. And i make myself happy and i'm a strong independent woman. It's still out a negotiation. Yeah right so we still have to to our partners needs and i think that ties back to lay wide. A women assume that the man has to be the one that in that i think part of it's like it's not even true. It's like know overly approached women in bars anymore. Are they gonna know has shifted in some way that i wasn't aware of but then they complain about that so it's like could you just step it up and do it yourself lying. There is like just all. I think because we've been ingrained with all these rules for so long. That awful book rules you many remigia in that like what. Put it in. Everyone's head. But i don't think that even if women are going to step up like meet her half way it doesn't have to be like oh. I'm always the one texting can go back and forth. Yeah absolutely we all should be equal partners in running sub trying to guess what the other person's thinking you know what you want to just go out there and try to pursue that it doesn't have to be in the form of like blunt going up to someone being like i want to date. You wanna sleep with you can still make at a bar or in a social outing to show interesting. Why does it have to be so tit for tat lake.
00:30:03 - 00:35:10
Well i can only to go out with him. If he approaches a draymond a friend. You wouldn't even think twice about just austing them and inviting them out. Yeah the guadalupe to wait for him to give three days. Yeah it is to invite you out on a saturday night either. go or don't go like housing. It's gotten out of hand. You also just things that are sort of newer to to dating. That maybe weren't around several years ago. It's like that. I think are just kind of ridiculous. The whole appearance of the ghosting behavior where appropriate to just like fade away. That's in way to end a relationship rather than having a conversation with a person or like the whole hitting quitted thing even if it's been like zebra dates. It's like you know all of these things you know. I wasn't consulted when these rules were made. It is and rules and okay. So what are some of our takeaways from all lists man so much here at the half your own. It's not rules dander. She had their own values. I still say values. It's like he when people say to picky or their their standards are too high. A 'cause it somehow shows that you're just better than everybody else in. The thing is secure hot yet but better way to put this is to say i have these specific values that i'm looking for in a partner and i'm just looking for someone to fit those values and to be aligned with my needs and my values that's it that's it so one is forget the rules. Think about you forget like the old way of dating. Forget about the new dating about how you want to date yet. Make your oil. I mean i think also like just moving fear like having that drive like the conversations you're gonna have in the actions of texting or whatever it is looking at as an opportunity to understand someone and learn more about how you guys interact opposed to like scare them away. Yeah totally. I think that also you know having your own. This is what i'm going to do. This is the way that i'm going to date. That's just a much more confident sexy way to do it when you know what you're going to do in what you're looking for and you have the confidence to approach things in that way that you shot and good things happen and i like this like you said like on your date with the guy you're currently seeing like talking about everything you should have six groups ball talk talk especially with especially like dating apps. I don't know how you matt booty. I have a lot of times. You have very few interactions to make that like date. One or two dozen go. Well if people write people off quick so why not get to the good stuff fast. Yeah and also establishing how you want to communicate with each other like This guy travels a lot for work during the weekend. Both been traveling a lot on the weekends and things like that so it was like a pretty long stretch of time when we were going to see each other. Usa who's like that. Make you feel like you know i know right. He's like do you feel located the way that we communicate which has been a lot of taxation and i was like well. You know i could do more communications. Jags like let's call each other. Let's face time. Let's really stay connected during the he hurts. Yeah and you can set those those things. I think that people are really afraid to call each other these days. I'm talking on the phone. Like i don't actually like i didn't like i would notoriously guys would ask me to talk on the phone. I would always say no but my ex boyfriend really liked talking on the phone better than texting. So i did it to that. Like obviously meet someone else's needs. But i actually in the end liked it a lot better actually have like conversation to lake texts but and then and then you don't necessarily have to be face to face to have a conversation can act the right here. Emotion voice over. Yeah so you know with like our amazon culture these days where everything's customize and they keep recommending products because he ordered this. Why can't we customize their own dating. I go back to. What are your communication preferences. We again those all the time in emails or email once and i prefer a phone call yet for tax. You're right we should be talking about that with our with not just partners with people in your lives. Yeah right tell. Everybody wants arson in your tax person. You could be annoyed that they're not texting enough. Yeah but that might not actually mean that they just don't like you and don't enjoy being around you and assumption you okay. Let's do a quick question of the day so this comes from maria recently. I've had a string of guys that having confirmed deaths until the very last minute in this behavior infuriates me. I have tried to explain to them. That i don't appreciate them disrespecting my time but instead of them apologizing they either stop responding to my tax or blocked me from the app's any ways you guys would suggest a purchase.
00:35:10 - 00:40:00
Miss kay well. Maria sounds very frustrating. One way to get around this is to a like margot said in the very beginning. Established how you like to be communicated to so before you go on the dates. Say i really appreciate a confirmation the night before but that up. It's about really teaching somebody. How do you want to be treated in the same day to you. Wanna be treated. It's really you know like you said it's negotiation. Us historically assume like oh. They don't confirm they're not into it. But they like me not even have on their radar thing. That's some people are are very last minute in run into this allow californians in east and for me like. I'm a really busy person. So if you don't get onto my schedule during the week you're probably not gonna get out there. It's just like i would say maybe not approaching it in a way that like this makes me so angry when you haven't even met somebody because i don't know about how you guys feel but until you meet somebody they're not really like a real make Yeah and there's so much abundance you can order another person in your pocket these days. So it's like you know. I would say they like listen. I really appreciate it if you confirm the night before yano and maybe the first state is gonna give me last minute thing in the you can talk about that on your date but yeah it seems like the guys are still showing up on. These dates is just confirming a very last minute. Which is the part. That bothers her. So i think instead of saying you're disrespecting my time who these guys don't know that right. They may just think well. I still showed up for the date. So that may come off very combative in so saying that i think she should say you know i really appreciate that. You plan the state and we went on at a great time just for the future. I really would appreciate a confirmation the night before to give me peace of mind. But we don't know she's actually going on the dates because it said that they would block in right right right. Yeah if she's calling them out. I think it definitely sent a lot of anger in the adage. So if you're calling someone out in a negative way like you said earlier. It's all about how you say ed. Yeah so that could people were probably like. I don't really want to spend time with somebody who's coming off Or early said margot like. I don't even know this person that they're bitching me the time for this. Yeah well it's you a said this in our episode the secret to modern dating with ned. I remember you said this idea about being like oh. I'm not going to have my phone or going to be away from my phone for a couple hours like just confirming or something to just like out there right then. That's something again that's putting it you in control oppose to waiting for someone else to do it literally. Why can't you just be like hey is like just confirming. We're starting i totally do that. Mckay just wanna make sure that you know whatever. I don't think that's a weird thing to do in that at all. And also you know if it's like on a on a workday or something. You're probably gonna get ready a little bit differently. If you're going right so like we need that little men actually confirming could just help much better date in man. that's true we're going to look a lot better than will be better. If you just heard sir. I'm speaking personally but matters go a long way with me. It's just totally sick. Basic matters like if you showed just a little bit of manners guys like it's gonna go a long way. It's going to be impressive. It's gonna stand out or empathy. Like i get ready in two minutes but maybe discount needs like a little early totta y-yeah or wants to do it. Yeah and i've also had brands like a friend's Recently tested texted me. Like what are you doing tonight like. I'm really bummed out. I said all this time getting ready this morning and then the guy cancelled halfway through the day. She is like now. I'm all like you know looking cute. bummed out. Just know that it. Has you know you hurt people's feelings than you do that so just try to be mindful. Conscientious yeah i always bring back the story the the reverse of it was. I met this guy on tinder and then we set of a day. And then i had a meeting that i had to take and i couldn't show i could go on the day so i cancelled last minute. And he called me out and said. Hey if you're sears. While meeting me than the ball senior core you plan the next time we meet if this is your excuse of getting out the date than i appreciate you just being more straightforward. And he totally called me. That's great you rarely that approach. 'cause that's also not like if he was just like oh i'll see if she reaches out and not actually say that to you. Yeah yeah then who knows what would have happened exactly. He wouldn't probably clear communicating instead of assuming sort of jumping to like being angry or gas. Or whatever it's just kind of like. Hey where are you at just feeling the situation. So it's like he almost like unloaded from his brain power. So he's like okay. Got it a lawsuit. You're you take control now.
00:40:01 - 00:44:45
yeah. I've also guys that a lot of girls cancel all the time we hear him from all the time. It's it is a thing it is writing so we just have to be more respectful of each other but again everyone has different thresholds of weight. They think it's okay right right. Some girls may find like last minute confirmation so k. And some people don't find that okay you just have to communicate it and i think there's nothing wrong with expressing how you feel but in a nice way yet. Nice empathetic way okay. Any other last thoughts on this. It's interesting by ninety nine year old grandmother. She said something to me. That i thought was so interesting kind of sad and also by like we need to shake this all up because she said to me. She's like i don't think that women have ever been integrator disadvantage in dating interest and i was just like. Oh my gosh. You were born in like thirties. Talking about cited made me really think about it i did. She say that we know. I shouldn't really ask her for more background. Maybe it's just because because she i actually. I think i might know this coming from because my grandmother's similar i think it's because they assumed because in their error people married and had children young so it's like they don't really understand why we'd want to be in our thirties in not necessarily married with children over. You opposed to like go you which also told me that. The biggest mistake that i made was getting a dog so this single. Because you just don't need a man. I'm like well it's not. I don't need that. I think it's just the changes so generational he'll cover your listening your years. Every generation has their own opinions. But we got a deal with the current situation as it. We can't there's nothing else we can do. So let's just make the best out of it. She'd come back to the nineteen thirties. But i think that the key is just to know yourself to to learn how to listen to what you want in the knocked on that in just communicate in a way that being empathetic other people but also disturbing what you want and what you need not feeling that that makes you a bad girl but it just makes you go girl. I love it. And i love that you have brought this entire life and it sounds like you've attracted someone that has asthma same boat. Yeah we'll see you see trauma see at least some say if nothing even happens from at least you're having the conversations in your stand. I know it hasn't been scary having this conversation. I should is scary. Yeah it should not be scary. Speaking of communication guys. We want to hear from you. I listen we want to know we bring you different topics every season and we want to know what you want to hear from and who were worried. Some of your favorite guests. We want some feedback to send some feedback if you like to be guests on her show just like margot Let us know well. We are still looking for more guests and I guess we should wrap this up. Stay data all your action items. This week is to take inventory of the things that don't make you feel so good in a relationship with someone in your life. That could be romantic or not and then think about a way of addressing these issues with that person in a way. That's not blaming them but it comes from a place of empathy and also comes around place negotiation. This episode of dateable is brought to you by five hundred brunches. Five hundred branches connect like minded people with similar interests to meet in real life over brunch. You answer a questionnaire about your interest and how you spend your time. And then they'll match you in small groups of six to eight at a brunch spot in san francisco get a free entry into a brench now by signing up at five hundred branches dot com and using the code date. Able if you didn't know already. We have a revamped website with articles videos and content all about modern dating. You can also find our premium watch series where we dissect analyze and offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums. We've had some great feedback. About how actionable these episodes are so check them out on her website or items music also visit the site today to see the latest about coaching where we connect you with. Dateable approved experts to help with everything from dating profile reviews coaching and even gathering real feedback about your dating style in personalized and affordable. Way to connect with us visit dateable. Podcasts dot com. You can also find us on facebook twitter and them all under dateable podcasts. Don't forget to subscribe an auto download the podcast on tunes or your favorite podcast player. So you never miss an episode.