Jack shares the biases that come from dating as a redheaded male – from being ruled out of the dating pool to being fetishized for his hair color. We talk about owning your identity, approaching people as individuals, and the problems leading with pure physical qualities.
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Season 8 Episode 7: Hot for Ginger
00:00:00 - 00:05:01
The Dateable podcast is an insider's look into modern dating that the Huffington post calls one of the top ten podcast about love and sex. On each episode, we'll talk to real daters about. From sex parties to sex droughts, date fails a diaper fetishes and first moves to first loves. I'm your host Yue Xu, former dating coach turned dating sociologists. You also hear from my co host and producer Julie Krafchick as we explored this crazy dateable world. Hey, everyone. Welcome to another episode of dateable a show all about modern dating. We've talked about gingers before with a co host has name was Aaron he loved gingers that was his thing. Right. But we haven't gone into this topic that deep yet. So our guest today, Jack is going to tell us about what it's like to be a ginger and also to date as ginger hijack Har grave, and I'm happy to be your first. Not on the podcasts. Very exciting. So Julia early in the day did a quick Google search. So she did the auto fill you know, when you type in on Google, she wrote do gingers, and this is what popped up do gingers, half blue eyes. Jinja's go ball ginger SCO, gray, ju just feel more pain have rights to ginger tan. Do they get gray hair feel less pain? Do they bleed more? Wow. They've ever the auto fills on Google. I mean, I think every good research project should start with just auto fill on because that gives you only different directions. So many different directions of what people are searching for on the internet about ginger specifically. So before we get into your experience, we want to talk about some of the studies have been done about gingers and dating. So according to a study published in psychology studies found that men who have had red hair aren't treated the same as their blonde or Brown haired counterparts, so they had this. Experiment, where they put men in different colored wigs to see who women would approach more. And the men who were in red wigs were rejected the most and only thirteen point eight percent of them got women to dance with them on the dance floor while men with Blacklock's lead the group with thirty five percent success rate at this was also a similar problem for their lady counterparts as well. So what what is interesting about this whole topic is that it's a little bit about it's like to me it's very similar to racial yet entity. But to others could be similar to your body identity your body issues. How you how you see yourself physically Jack? When you think about what we just talked about. You're you're in your mid thirties. You've lived in San Francisco for three years from Minneapolis. You're currently single inactivity going on dates what is it like dating ginger yet? I mean, I think a lot of that goes back to your identity as a redhead, you know, it's it's really hard growing up with a redhead. Like, you talked about the groups that are bully. Lead in you know, in like the playground, and like like call every name in the book, you know, from like carrot top to fire crotch. You know, calmer topic I heard every single name growing up as a kid you'd like you just want to sit in you, don't you don't you don't wanna be different. I think it's something that redheads embrace as they get older they kind of find themselves and become more confident. But I think those early formative years where you like you're on the playground. And and kids, you know, how kids are these look for that one thing that's different about you in town like, you know, pick on that. And the Kelly names about that. And I think a lot of red heads. I know grew up with sort of like less confidence because they that was called out as like something that was not only different about them. But some that was kind of like inferior. So when did, you know your red head? I dunno know, I was Chinese until I moved to America. It was something like that that my family, my parents and extended family, and especially like old people would call it constantly as like a let's say five six year old kid with bright red hair. What I remember? Most is like going to church with my family, and there'd be all it was always the elderly people with like white hair. And if you let like, oh, you've got such beautiful red hair medicos girls on the playground are all over you. And I'm like, what are you talking about nineteen exact opposite? I don't know. But it is in times of change. You know, that sound like why like why do obvious adult think this red hair is such a gift in a blessing is is like it's something terrible. Because as a kid, it's just something. You're you're sixty Prada tension to do we know where this Kidger name stemmed from. I don't know the the origin of the name. I know like a lot of slang terms globally. I think maybe it's like a British thing or something. But there was a south park episode won't now ten years ago or something where like same situations red kid at school, and they're all picking on him, and then like carbon or whatever, you know, comes up with this thing. Like gingers have no souls. The sunshine because they'll burst into flames. Like this. This to like, there's this special class of genders. They call them day walkers, and they can go out in the sun and the rest of you.
00:05:01 - 00:10:00
But they're just as Solis all the other ones of I I saw that. I was like Wilson I'm a day Walker. I'm one of the more normal ones that I'm still in this category. And then like in the wake of that episode of their national kick ginger. Oh my God. Luckily, I was. I was I wasn't like in school for that. But if I feel for the kids on a playground when something like that comes out, and it's like, oh, go round kicked red-headed kid. Like protests and like that because bowling some interesting race that you could be like someone's big race. This like discriminate against your hair color, but it is kinda discrimination. So you know, how like everyone needs to feel bad for blondes have dumb blonde jokes. Oh blondes. Like, it's it's funny. They're just like they're airheads is this. Yeah. Nobody's me need to blondes. Like, there's no kick a blonde day. Right. It's like like blonde jokes are relatively harmless. We are literally there's like the phrase red headed stepchild like like a rapid very very different. And so that's something that for my identity when I was younger, and then as as I grew up got more confidence in and became, you know, like like comfortable with who. I was now I embrace it. And I I like I liked it. It makes me different. You know? Because now, I I think as you get older you wanna stand out insert, especially in the dating scene. You wanted to brace the things that make you different make you special. If you are indeed confident about those things warring with red hair. Yeah. Okay. 'cause I know some blondes that were born as blondes, and then they turned red later in line. I was I started out like pretty gingery like. The pretty orange freckles, very pale skin, very red hair. And then as time has gone on. It's like it's now like almost brunette it's been pretty dark to the point where like in dark bar. I kind of like rodak. Yeah. We first met you didn't even know that. Yeah. Incognito. Redhead before we go too far. Do you want to say where the origins of jerk because we actually did some research? No one is very clear. So the fact that you weren't sure is kind of out there, but there's a couple origins. There's the ginger nickname came down to the ginger root. That's used in cooking to give it a bit of a kick just to refer to your fiery temper, not so much the looks of the ginger root. But the Howitt that kick let it get a fiery temper also stems from the fact that you have red hair. So there's like a corresponded that like your read that's like hot color like correlation with temper also this ginger flavor. Food which tends to show an Auburn reddish tinge of ginger cake to Brad ginger snap. So that's referring to the color. Yes. In the last one that came up was there is American TV show from the sixties that was Gilligan's island where there is the character ginger that was a redhead. So there's a thought that it kind of stems from that in pop culture in the sixties wasn't the shown black and white. No. Employing run this on the internet. But that is a really valid point. Yeah. Good point that was like her characteristic. I feel like it was like drawn. She was a redhead. So with that in mind. How did this translate into you dating as a full fledged adult to you you've experienced as identity you've experienced bullying that came with it? And then what about later when you grew up. I remember actually what I first started online dating very vividly like late twenties or something like as I'm gonna make it. Okay. Cuban profiling put myself out there. You know? I like, I did a debate organically these relationships. I was like I was confident enough like just want to get out there, and like data much people might not what I want. I mean this. This was the point win. I was fully embracing the ginger angle. I'm like, yeah. I'm red-headed proud. You know, like, I'm I feel like I am a moderately attractive in confident red headed man, I'm going to go own it. What about you from being like thinking, it was like a down thing to embracing it? I don't think he was just a really just working on myself and becoming owning it. Yeah. I mean, I mean, well grow- growing up and becoming mature. I started a career in finished grad school and did a lot of things to better myself. Just got into a lot of things that I felt like made me a well-developed person in. And I think it's kind of like you said, you know, all these things are important to a mate. And I felt like I had a lot of those things maybe the red hair was the one strike against. But I was like whatever, you know, everything all these. I've all these other things that I feel like our potentially appealing to a mate that I could you know, that I can put out there should be able to successfully date cut it, you know. Okay. So I guess I signed me this. Okay. Cupid profile furnaces like the old days the online dating because he used to fill out a very extensive while you know, all these things by yourself. And then you could also read a lot of things, but other people in real kind of get to know them through their profile.
00:10:00 - 00:15:10
Now, it's literally like what had shot and like one line if that I like to laugh. Yeah. Just all emojis. Right. Exactly. So so this was back when the museum profiles were much more robust. And so you like read a lot about this person. And then you would get down to the bottom there. Maybe like ten key stats in. You would go. Here's neat. And then here's my match. And so you could specify what you're looking for. It's most people were pretty open minded, it'd be like hotly go to girls profile, it'd be like my my ideal mash, okay, he is between five foot five and six foot seven. Yeah. You know, he is one of these four ethnicities, you know, he has facial hair. Or does it doesn't matter. You know, she used them within fifty miles of me whenever and then there was one. I was like visa or the different hair colors that I will accept in my I'll I guess you'd never thought about it. If you were to right. And so at you know, as as these as people were searching, you know, their search results would be reflected by what what they were looking for. And so they're probably ten different hair-color boxes that you could check. Tell you because many people would check every single box format while they would not regret. And so I'm I'm they're like, oh, I just read this long profile everything. Checks out looks good. Looks good. Looks good happening all of these things and I get down to the hair color box. And there's like nine being listed, and I'm like, where's right reservoir, L shit. They didn't check right back. I'll only talk ledge is light Brown dark Brown. Black gray ball. You did not check the red hair box. But you checked baller gray against guys who are bald or have gray hair? But I'm sitting here as red head like, okay? At some point. I'm going to be like eighty years old, and my here's either gonna turn gray or fall out completely. And better chance, I'll be more attractive. So. This is like why do you think women are anti redheads? I it's a stereotype or it's the image of Yuga like if someone tells you imagine a red headed man, Loic wide. What comes to MIT a my leg the kid from Harry Potter, right? I think head I didn't know not not Harry Potter. Oh, we usually you're on without eyebrows. Eyebrows. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. You imagine someone in like like pasty white skin. Like like just awkward looking a not traditionally handsome as pop culture populate like how many movies show like the handsome debonair suave, red gentlemen, you know, that the girl falls for. It's maybe it's like the dorky awkward had a guy that gets the girl in the end because it's a rom com. United's like she gets rid of the handsome jackass because there's this charming redhead who's like down to earth guy, even though he's but ugly and awkward don't know. Like some Hollywood exact in like, thirties or forties. His wife cheated on him with a redhead. That's under a bucket. I make from here. I'm going to demonize redhead profitably Email from the Sarang Landa so random I think it's just it's just the image that you get. So I've also it encountered like usually on a first date or maybe the second date women will save things like of, you know, never thought it would be on with a red head. Or even like, you know, you're actually like like kind of attractive for a redhead. Oh. That to your face or like, I've never I've never been attracted to men, but you're kind of cute. Wow. That's supposed to be some kind of complicated. It's like this backhanded kind of thing. Wow. So how did you tell us have you back into your Dany low with the studio confidence? I mean, dating is very competitive. You know, there's a lot of people out there trying to date and playing to their strengths in various ways. So part of me is like we'll take it. It's a compliment it might be back in. They might be saying, well, you know, every other redhead is is awkward and not someone I want to spend time with, but you're kind of cute. So I'll give you a chance. Like, you're not awkward for something kind of like white guess, I'll take it. But it also kind of tells you something about that person. I think you know, 'cause you're like, oh that will they're actually kind of close minded and also rude. Why would you say? Set that the you're like, you're kinda cuchara black man like all hell would break out. Yeah. Like, how is it really any different lasted on internet? Right. That's what I'm saying. I'm so surprised because they haven't had protests than like an uproar because you never have like a kick in Asia prison day as instead of you like to Roseau fucked up anyway. Okay. When you like, you can probably sense. Yeah. There are some similarities to like feeling like a maligned segment of the population. I I would I would never make the connection to like in actual minority group that is actually light discriminated against because we have red hair. It's not it's not like we're actually being discriminated against. It's just that. I think we have this fiscal future than most of the population feels like is unattractive, and when they think of somebody with this physical future, they just imagined someone who's like awkward or not not desirable.
00:15:10 - 00:20:01
You know, but but I wouldn't make that connection to like an actual being an actual minority group that actual has problems with discrimination. Although the hot cast you sent us before this to enlighten us about being redhead. Yeah. There was this whole part on there. How it was viewed as Connectik deform nation to do. Remember that part? Yeah. It's I mean, it's a recessive trait. I think they describe it as a deformity. Yeah. But not a physical deformity to form a deformity of the genetic levels of gene in this almost recessive traits for me like aiming lacking as your unique because there's not that many. That's what my mom told me ever since. I was a child. It's those people that are like mixed race. You have green is for some reason, none of their none of the relative. Sue, it's a recessive, gene. It's should be celebrated. Right. So with obviously these women were not checking off or they're not checking the red box the red hair box. What about the women who were what was that? Like did you find women who only check the red pair box? No, definitely did not find that. Interesting thing was I would get messages from the women who did not check the red box. Eyebrows, unites. You had someone like who checked every box, but the red red box, and I'd be like whatever next move on. I'm actually at a message from them the next day. And maybe like, hi how you doing whatever icebreaker, and sometimes I would call it out. Now, not like a bitter way like to check the red box. And just kind of like, hey, you know, like, yeah. Let's let's have a conversation. You seem interesting. But by the way, I couldn't help. But notice you checked every hair color box except for red. What's up with that? And that was usually when I would get those kind of backhand, like, well, you know, just I've never met her at headed guy. I was attractive, and I can't envision really ever meeting one that OB track too. So I just didn't check off apps now where there isn't that? But it's not, you know, it's not the kind of thing. Where like, I'm sure you guys know like on on on apps. Women will say if you're under six feet tall, don't bother or like or other dealbreakers. But usually it's high there never saying if you have red hair than dome message me is not something that's call out at that level. But I think if if a survey is put in front of him in there, like, you know, which are colors would you prefer to Dayton? Then it's comes down at the bottom. Look like, you have red hair in your profile. Yes. There might be a filter applied toned down a little bit. Toned down blond Dak gin anywhere on. But yes, I think being into it like around the time. I was on that on. Okay, cupid. I did have sort of the intersections. I listened to your your podcast what eating agents. Yeah. Well, yellow over yellow fever yet. So I did Asian girl. How in my mid twenties. So, yeah, I'm like, you know, kid growing up in Minnesota wished either are Sophon, white, maybe. On to run like what first or second day. She's like, she's like, okay. Wait, have you ever dated in Asian go before because I'm this white red headed, dude, you know, from less than I'm like, no, she's like, well, the main thing is if you if you ever want to date in Asian girl after me, you cannot tell them Asian. I'm like, what are you talking about? What's real? And she's like, well like we have this rate of Asian girlfriends, we have this radar like an I heard you see this like the last three girls you needed regime. Yeah. We don't. Yeah. Deal breaker, we dated for close to a year, then she actually moved away. She would Hong Kong we wrote up. But I like we see the touch was one of those things like we still talked and she she invited me to visit her like after you. And by we were apart for about a year, just like doing our own thing. And it did happen that like in that year. I dated a few other agent girls. Okay. Like, I broke up. We broke on Pandora's, Ivanka, exactly. Fashiony move like my exit was the Hong Kong, and I go on this one year sort of tear, you know, and I'm on. Okay, cupid and no one wants to eat the headed anyway. But I'm out there. Anyway. I end up eating like slick some women who ended up being agent, and whatever short-term things. So after years, she's like, she's a come. And visit me in Hong Kong. I miss you. And I I want to reconnect, and I was like I said why? So I go to Hong Kong and literally in the first hour that I'm there. She's like we need to talk just flew like fifteen hours. You know, what like what's? So what's urgent? And she's like I've been looking at your Facebook over last year, and I couldn't help. But notice there's a lot of like changs and Chan's. My dogs and like where all these Asian women coming from. And so she was giving me shit about it for about a week while we're like in Hong Kong, we're walking around like, and she's like, oh, you think she's hot you'd think she's hot. You must love being surrounded by all these beautiful Asian women.
00:20:01 - 00:25:02
The the last day in Hong Kong, we're like we're going to this bar, and she's like just want to let you know this bar tonight. There's going to be this guy that I dated. I moved Hong Kong like just be cool about it. Of course, analogy jealous. So we're chilling his bar this guy walks in she's out. That's that's the God's house. A he's a white guy. He walked under the light. He's a fucking red hat. Gyms like gin like more gingery than me, what if announcer him do, you know, if there's no well, no do. She's she's married now. And he's pale. He's not maybe maybe a little like strawberry. But and I was like, okay. Wait, you're talking to me about dating another Asian girl after you. Yup. We have Asians in Minnesota. I think you find the one red headed guy in. Like like, it's a supply and demand thing. Right. So how many of them are you found the only read and do? So that was my first experience with like, okay, either. There is an attraction out there to red headed men on the part of some like certain women, or it's one of those like once you go read, you know. Stay in bed, right? That's funny. My whole dating career. I've wanted to like I've been trying to come up with some kind of once you go black. You never go back their heads. Listen. Love it. I like, so we have a friend. He is the legit ginger fetish. Like, maybe finish the rower, but he has a preference for ginger. He's ginger himself primitives as he dates men loves he Lahser his hairy yoga for reference. Have you had any encounters of a woman that solely league? I know you're acts had another but have you ever met? Anyone? That's like date after date is ginger. I will say that. I I think the perception of ginger men versus ginger women is different. Hell, yeah. So the ginger woman as women typically are sexualize now. It's like, oh, the sexy raven hit Lah. Yeah. Jessica rabbit. Yeah. They like like Lindsey Lowe head point eighty Adam Adam Steiner. Steiner hair to get more jobs in Hollywood. She was a she was blonde. There was something I read that doing extensive research for this. That's redhead women have more sex than brunettes in blah again. Sure that is where that Sita point came from five. Yeah. I think I think like the when they when they tell you imagine a red headed woman, you know, guys, imagine like red hair green eyes, you know, like like pale skin, very beautiful, you know, like this long flowing red hair, you know, and when you think of the male red headed like carrot top about Pippi Longstocking, I feel like that's not a positive. I think that image has evolved. Resolve this. We just have to find really hot ready. Celebrity to be the pioneer we need good role models. Yeah. Actually when the Prince Harry thing happened. My sister, Mr. told me that I should put on on my bumble profile like KB like my face extent patera. She's. He really put gingers on the map. He I think I absolutely think he did. And he's not even like the best looking ginger out there. But he definitely got on the map gave us recruit. Meghan Markle something in this guy sandwich test the waters dirty like dating apps forgers. Oh, yes. There is only knows only dating genders yea. But I only know about that. Because I did go on one date in my entire dating Grier. Where the woman was interim has okay. And this was I had to go all the way to Paris. I haven't seen her since I have not encountered anyone. But we I was spending a week in Paris. I was kind of traveling solo. I'm like why maybe I'll just get on Tinder and see, you know, making all the drink with the local, you know, to see see how goes and so I start swiping on match with this. She was like Dr kinda like like Israeli living in Paris designing like Louis Vuitton bags or something. And sounded like like, you know, what? She sounds interesting. She definitely at least go have a drink with her. So we meet up at this little bistro, you know, relied in the first five minutes cheek basically cuts the small talk. And she's like, there's a reason why I swiped right on you specific. And I'm like super dri. Like racking, my brain light on my God. What's those first picture was what I have on that profile, and it's someone. List that would immediately make someone be like I want to have a drink with this guy. How because I was never happened. She's like there's there's something that really really turned me onto you as like going on. What what was it like Louis, and she goes, I imagine stream Lee attracted to red headed men, and I can't get enough of Emily.
00:25:02 - 00:30:01
Wow. So she would have checked that box like trail on. This was the girl I been looking for since I okay cupid day. Ecstatically checked the how'd you feel what she cut of it away? Objectified. You. I think it I I felt really good. Never. Right. Yeah. Yeah. She's yeah. She's hot. Alike in the back of my mind. You know, the is like the PC party mind. That's like, I'm being objectified. But then there's like the man yard that. You're like. Yeah. Baby. Just objective by I don't. I don't care. What it is. Now, a deed in the first five minutes. She's like, you have this sexy red hair, and I get enough on your like. Yeah. Yeah. Going down there. And she says she's sitting there like I am only attracted to red headed, man red hair. Just does something for nothing else. Does I'm still just like flabbergasted. I'm staring her like like, you've got it backwards. This lick red hair doesn't attract limit it repels limited. And I know that my whole life gadding he finally someone don't fat for right away. Because there's so few heads out there. Her like ticket is so slim. Yeah. But anyway, I get wrong. That is true. She cleans. Yeah. So here I was a middle in town played three days in this. She found me and so. So like, you know, the first five minutes is comes up, and I was like, so I have so many questions for you. The scars when you know you. Finish it. Okay. She was like only embrace. Yeah. And so my my first question was how do you feed your urge with gas apply red headed? How do you find these guys because clearly like tenders is a crap shoot. If we're two or three percent of the population writing a lot. By our law. The premium account lets you dislike still really fast. Otherwise, just wiping day wondering the first five minutes she dropped that on me because she swiping. Like month cash. All around the clock. I found you, and we both know why we're here. So. On the business. So so yes, so my first question was how do you find the steady stream red headed men to your desires that she leans in looks around. Make sure no one's listening. She's like, there's a website the website. You can go to and I wasn't surprised, but I was still like I I've never heard of a I've never heard of the red headed dating website out now. And I'm like, okay. I'm totally listening at this point. And she's like take out your phone and type in hot for ginger dot com. Ooh. Number four with spelled out for F O R. Okay. Hot for ginger by. Okay. I'm going on it now. So it turns out she went. She went on this website. She must've Google then founded, but she she she's like, that's my the main place that I go to find red headed men. The problem is it's only for ginger on ginger how it's head has ads redheads to date other redhead, I think it's probably started by redhead. Who's like we're going extinct guys? Now more red head. Because you've gotta like some of you guys are going on Asian women. I like brawling cases melting pot. We've got. We got gotta keep these redheads gone. So I think that was the point of the site she she was like Subaru depressed when she was like, she's guess I tried to make an account like she had found the site. But it has all the meant she wants and she's like create account, and it's like, okay what what's your account name? And she's like ginger lover sixty nine. Okay. What what's your high boat? Blah was where do you live or what what's what her cloud you have? And she she checked black, and it immediately voted her out of the side shish a trick. Then. Yeah. So it's almost like poetic Justice. That was like you mean, you didn't check the red. I'll bet to check box Ron. To the site, and it and it was like, we're sorry. Hot for ginger dot com is only for gingers to meet other gingers. You're not allowed on this side. So how do you feel about ginger girls? Yeah. Would you go on hot for chin, by the way? There are two percent and hot for ginger. Those are their hash out for ginger. Yes. The two percent and to be honest since I've gone back to that site. Lil asked him win it said Hartford internet calm the dating site for gingers and those who loved that. What does it? So I think this lead zinc, they realized now I think they realized it was too much of a niche like there aren't enough Thomas is out there. Now. Okay. So back to do you. How do you feel about ginger women? Let's take a quick break and get intimate for a sec for those of you.
00:30:01 - 00:35:03
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And I was just wasn't attracted to them the population. Samples has just so small heads wasn't like you were going on like hundreds of foods, not very small part of that yet. So levers sent. My own. They might be scale dates at Ed with ads is is in proportion to the population. Be honest with you, I tend to date non white women. And I I don't like done some reflecting on this. Like, I think part of it is like a group with very pale skin. I saw how that was on attractive to people. And I kinda hated it as growing up, you know, and growing up became I was very attracted to women who had like like nice hand like darker snobby. Yeah. Like, it's so so to me like like darker skin at darker features like things that I didn't have that. I sort of like found on attractive like those features are are attractive to me. So on this site. It says you can either challenge each other as two genders or chat with ginger files. Not there's those are the people who only like gingers this website when never fly for anything. That's grace Reich maJ was like hot for Asian be via porn site that not yet. Bathing dating sorry like that. What's it called ginger files of injure file Asian mile? No, no, I feel like this will get you better than France files. A complaint lawsuit to them. That's interesting because you there's a site for Asian sedate other Asians. Yeah. There's a site for east meets east yet relic, shoes, JJ guided. Yeah, there's like a what is it black singles or something like that? And so it's it's like, it's acceptable for the for certain groups to Danish all heard, but if you're like I wanted someone from this group than that becomes creepy are not cool. But we also know me about who'd been on Jay day who are Jewish wanna data. Nice Jewish girl. Right. Yeah. I mean, I think this is a good segue. Takeaways which is interesting because I think this whole thing persists like we've gone back and forth. Like how is this like race? And how is it different in its obviously, clearly different. Like, you said, it's not like a marginalized group in that sense. But it is a marginalized in the Mars allows her way in like, yes, definitely a lot of overlap of how people are treated, and I think like just because it isn't race doesn't mean that like there should. Be such an unconscious bias on it. I'm just saying that someone may have that. Because that always happens anyways. Like, you know with race people still have that bias, even though us shouldn't have it. So it's just interesting that it's like there's such a parallel. But also is so different too. I think so many parallels. I see so much of it. Because I think the reason why any speaking in Asia woman, you're damned if you do your damned if you don't if a guy told me on his first Asian than I would say, he's checking the boxes right now. He's just going down the list. He's not serious about me. But if he's only dated Asian that I questioned his tastes like this could have been any sort of Yellen. So I probably say the same about your dating situation, if someone just just brings up the fact, they're only attracted to you for this one thing this one then you have no control over than it kind of makes it not evil in.
00:35:03 - 00:40:00
I can finish that thought by finishing the story of the the girl in Perez who just for my red here. I mean that over the first five minutes for a. Minutes. I was kinda basking in the adoration, you know, like, oh, finally someone who, you know, loves red hair as much as the old ladies in Becan church. Did you know when I was a kid? It turned out. We we actually didn't have anything else to talk about. Oh, we didn't have. We didn't really have anything else in common. Like an and maybe we did. But the fact that she had brought it up immediately kind of through the whole date off like the rest of the day. It was just kind of like sort of awkward jokes about oh, you're redheads in you know. Kevin the thing that kept on going back to that. And it was something we couldn't really get past because she just threw that out there. Like, I'm here because I love redheads, and I'm like, okay, that's cool. So what else do you like, you know? I didn't I tell guy friends that story. You know, I've been like, oh, do you like so you met this hot Isreaeli growing terrorists? Like, you guys totally bang after that. 'cause you know, she just told you she loves redheads, and I'm like, no, honestly, we had kind of an awkward conversation. And it just kept going back to this awkward thing about her giving this fetish redheads, and then we kinda parted ways 'cause never really connected or had real chemistry. It just felt kind of strange. Let's take away to lake there. You can have a reference or something. But that's really the only foundation that you're growing off of something. Like, maybe valuate why you're actually doing that. Yeah. If that's what you're leading with right? That's never a great way to get into someone's pants. I don't know. Right. I just feel like there's so much. There's so many ways we can approach someone and by approaching someone based purely on their physical look. Yes, not. It's never the right way. Even it even it's just completely superficial. Everyone loves a good compliment. But what makes you attracted to someone? It's not just their physical looks right, right? I'm just thinking like if this was like, wait like hide or anything else? Like if they were like, oh a short complex or like south. Yeah. Just be so awkward oh. Like, my friends in New York who are all plus size women, and they call these men that love them chubby chasers. 'cause they would actually be in this group. It's a group called tummy chasers. And they said, you know, it's fine because he's been obviously, really love the way they look. But at the same time, they're very, much objectified. And federal is it's interesting because I've never thought about hair in the sink quality. Like, I think we always hear men complain a women don't like me 'cause I'm under six feet or to play in like, oh, I'm not attracted to men because I'm not a size zero or whatever. But we've never like thought about hair color as much Jack. Have you ever thought about dying your hair at any point? Never. I don't know what color would diet. I I don't think I would feel like myself Ryan it because of this point it's part of my identity. I kinda would feel like I was not being true to myself. I've come a long ways in kind of accepting that and having it be a part of who. I am kind of. Owning it. So if if I were to like, diet black or something, it would kind of be like, I I recognize that this is a handicap in the dating world. So I'm just gonna take my chances better in blend with everybody else. And that's not what I'm about. Well, there is like the sense of owning it, right? Like, I think there's a the whole body, positively movement is like owning what you look like in a way, this is similar of like, this is the hair I was given rang like you were saying, I would be a different person if I had different hair-color, right? Not who I am. It just shows. You also it's it's part of who we are. But also were unique identities. So Jack, you are who you are not because you're a redhead, but because of everything you've experienced in your life. So when we approach people in dating we also push him as an individual not as a group. So I get this question a lot because when I used to do dating coaching. I get questions like, oh, I want date American women. What does that like can you give me some pointers? It'll be like one of the top questions. I get were to I'm in Hong Kong for two weeks. I really wanna meet some nice Asian girls. How do I meet them in? What do I say to them? You can't group people like that. Because it went so different as Louis. I mean, if someone asked me what what's it like today read, I have no idea. I mean, I that were small segment of the population. I don't know them. He other small handful of other guys, but they're all very different. And you're never dated read. Never do. I wouldn't know. And I I don't I don't think they would all have similar dating styles. I think everyone yelich you said despite how we may look alike, but we're all totally different people. See that's just not a compliment. If someone says all I'm really into 'cause I love ones run clown of compliments. So stop with nothing to do with you, Hugh. Exactly. Yep. A future you have.
00:40:00 - 00:45:03
Yeah. And I think the last thing is like I think in general any looks whether it's positive or negative just like it's just as -fensive in like, no matter how it is like the chubby chasers. That you were talking about were red heads singling them out because of that like it's just not a great way to start anything off. I mean, I I would add to that. I think it's okay to have a preference for what you're attracted you physically. You know, people taking the wrong way or express the runway when the o on really into blondes. Right. I'm really, you know, this kind of girl if it's normal. I think to be attracted to certain physical features, you, you know, you might you might be. Physically attracted to people with blonde hair or people with a certain Bill there certain heights, or you know, or or maybe even ser- Neth necessities that have certain physical features that you find attractive. But I think we're across the line is when you go oh people who are Asian. I'll have this kind of personality. I like that, you know. And and that's kind of how that girl the that. I will explain it to me. She's like, she's like, you know, we're kind of the fetish comes in with whether it is with Asians, or redheads, whatever other groups is if you apply some kind of expectation for the personality. Yeah. 'cause they're part of that group. I can't generalize personality attributes based on physical attributes Well, I I agree that people could have preferences. However, I do think it's limiting like I remember one of our guests saying that she actually only liked blondes and redheads, and I think like people are gonna have preferences, and you can never like swayed people from them. Yeah. But also, I guess would suggest people opening up preferences wherever they can't not limiting. People either I think it comes down to media and what were exposed to. We are attracted to certain features. Because that's what we've been exposed to as attractive growing up when you think of a redhead using of carrot top. Which is who I think of ri-. Fortunately, maybe it's time to Google hot ginger mid. There's so many of them do it. Do you wanna do I want to do it? I was looking at them the other day. I was like damn sure there's so many out there. It's just that they're not at the forefront. You know, when it comes to what we see on TV in in the movies, but they're out there. So it's about how there's some hot ginger vet. I air guys rip, right? Listeners do a Google search Google search as a gerbil every time you find yourself attracted to a certain type. That's when you start questioning your type, why is it that I liked this height wise it at like really like these features and start going backwards start thinking about what are some other features like open myself up to right. That's how date with an open mind because you only know what you know. So expand your knowledge base. Awesome. Any for quick question of the day show? Do. This comes from Lauren. I go all the time with my friend Kristy who was blonde blue eyed, which I can't boobs guys hit on her all the time. So as I feel invisible around her because all the attention. She gets I'm Burnett who is a bit more plane. I'm thinking about dyeing, my hair blonder, but I'd never change my hair Styler or color before. Do you think? I should just go for it. Oh my goodness. I remember in when I was living in New York this at a really good friend. Carey who had it always go out with blonde, blue eyed, gigantic boobs. Did you submit his? Help guys give me some of ice. Ars we go to the same bars because that's you good at your neighborhood bar, and she'll get hit on constantly just by like everybody because one she's beautiful, but to she had this like really sunny personality. So people love talking to her. And I remember one day. I went into the same bar by myself. She was a with me in the same guys hit on her hitting on me. And I would add I would ask them. I stand you before I've talked to you. And they had no recollection of who. I was because I was always the after thought were that the the person being overshadowed by her not that I I didn't have any resentment towards her. But then I was like how do I make myself war of at Yanjing grabbing person next to someone who is very like who who does get a lot of attention. Right. I struggle with that quite a bit in my life yet. I think it's less about the hair color and more about just the overall vibe that's probably being given on sillage. What you just said. Like even from hearing, this it sound. Like this very like I'm average on boring like that situation going on. So I don't think you should change your hair color to like be blonde in hot. But may be like changing your hairstyle or like making a little tweak could give a little extra confidence in Maine, you feel refreshed. So that's the case, I think go for it. But don't go for it. Just to like make yourself fit. Another stereotype while studies also show that blondes Djukic hit on the most blonde men and women because we are attracted to shiny, objects and blonde is the closest color to shiny objects is just what were our eyes are drawn to.
00:45:04 - 00:50:03
So I I wouldn't say if you're looking depends on what your end goal is if you're laying for more attention shirt dire near blonde or shiny. But if the end goal is to meet someone that you really click with that person will find you beyond whoever's around you. Right. So you just have to again with Julia was saying carry that confidence. But also. If you're somewhere, if you always wear dark colors, this is just psychologically were attracted to light or callers when we go out, we just are is naturally go that way. So just wear lighter colors, white collar for people to wear when they go out and want some attention. So there's other ways you could potentially do it without without changing your s or maybe make sure you're smiling to impose sitting weighty. I could just I'm not again, I'm I don't know because I haven't seen this interaction. But if you're like constantly Guatieri, your friend getting attention. You might not be like the Pepys happiest version of grew great. If you're looking to have sex with the finding headed women, so you should not your bread understanding that depending on your objective. That's true die your hair red actually that that is a why not have any advice for Lauren, Jeff as a male other than die your hair? Unexperienced situation. Like that where you felt like you were overshadowed by a friend that you're going out with. Yeah. Probably I mean, I think being a red headed man, sometimes you do feel like it is one of those qualities rely. Yes, you're at the bar with three or four other guys. You know, you're the one with red hair, you know, sort of like something that, you know, like Lauren is saying, you know, maybe you feel like it's something that you'll get less attention. You know because of that. I mean that being said, I don't really pick up girls bars. I don't really worry too much about that. But but yeah, I I could see how she feels next to her friend like it probably boils down to like confidence. You know, confident owning what you have in being like this. This is the person that I am happy with that person. And I'm gonna put it out there. Right. And she might find even if she does her hair blonde, but doesn't do what you just said that my act tad help that 'cause then her hair will be fried to stuggle doesn't make. I guess the advice is look to yourself. I in see if there's other tweets he could make before dying the hair a lot of it is it's a confidence in the vibe that you're giving us that comes from white. How you feel about yourself? Right. All right. Any other takeaways for a very enlightening discussion. I will have to look at our Google search history. I think we have the biggest ginger fetish. I think you get a sponsorship from offer ginger dot com. I mentioned that. Sponsored my Dr. Over next gonna have hot ginger men and on my wall mazing it's going to be injured this epidemic. Like, we're gonna make oxygen bad hot. Go handedly, everyone who walks in here should walk out being like damn I need to go data ginger right now. But it's supply and demand you're saying, so you're like the only one within a fifty mile radius. Right. Right. So you get all of. Yeah. But what I think what I'm seeing is. There's not a lot of supply also not a lot of demand. So I need. Goose that demand because then we've got a high demand low supply thing, and that's that's best for you. It's all people. Ars genes. A similar story. Our listeners we love to hear from you something that you can relate to with Jack story, or you know, we just we'd love hearing these stories about a different perspective and a different experience that we're just not used to hearing on a daily basis and also were booking guests for future seasons. If you like to be a guest on our show, just go to debut, podcast dot com. John wrap this up. Stay little your action item for this week is to list out the stereotypes, you have other people be painfully honest with yourself because you're the only one who gets to see this list next go through each stereotype. And try to think of why you think this way does it objectively make sense and has it in any way prompted the way you date, sometimes when we break down our own on conscious bias, we gain a different perspective on what we've always believed to be the truth. Want to continue the conversation. I tag us in any post with hashtag stay dateable, then head on over to our website dateable podcasts dot com there. There. You'll find all the episodes as well as articles videos and our coaching services with vetted industry experts. You can also find our premium y series where we dissect analyze an offer solutions to some of the most common dating conundrums to connect with us. Find dateable podcasts on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter. We're also downloadable on Spotify. I teams and other podcasts platforms your feedback is valuable to us.
00:50:04 - 00:50:09
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